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Old May 9th 2013, 04:36 AM   #1
 
  Apr 2009
  Poplar Bluff, Missouri
The federal standards were written by wildlife. Wildlife were immediately exempted from the document. That is just like obamacare, they impose a healthcare plan for the rest of the country but the government don't want the plan to pertain to them.?? We all know that these rules and standards that everyone keeps saying WE ask for were written to put us out of business. NADEFA wants to keep the borders to all states open and their ideal when this started is to open up texas for business to the north. So they pushed for this federal rule were everyone could operate under the same rules. Meanwhile the states adopt methods to pretty much keep everyone on the same field and trade is better than ever without FEDERAL REGULATION!! At USAHA in october patty klein showed a set of standards that was to put guidance to the rule that was already adopted. Nadefa executive director was ok with them being put out for comment then. He said that we can get them in place and fix them later, but charly and laurie were there to object and that is when the working group was formed to fix this detrimental document. I am name throwing stones at anyone, nor am i praising anyone but just telling the real story. We have went months working and working without any progress, even the state vets are saying the document is flawed beyond repair. In a private meeting with clifford charley was told that we could throw out the standards if the entire industry support and the state vets was on board. This would mean coming back to the table WITHOUT WILDLIFE. When that announcement was make everyone made charly out to be a liar, and that is total bullshit. Charly, Laurie and Eric have lost a lot of skin trying to help the cervid industry while NADEFA have tried everything to persecuted them for it! So we didn't take the opportunity to throw out the standards and pushed forward to exhaust all options with negotiations. For some reason we have the idea that these USDA people are out friends and we are going to all sit around have hold hands after this is over! So we thought that we are going to make some kinda progress on the DC trip. At the meeting clifford told us that this working group will conclude in 60 days and it was going to comment. There will be no pulling it back at that point and now we have showed that we are divided and blown every opportunity to get rid of this document. We are too damn stupid to listen to more than one person, shawn has had the lead this whole time and now we going to get a document that is going put us out of business. How long do we last when we test 100% of the animals and wildlife test less than 1%. They will point the finger at us until the public runs us out of town!! It is already happening in florida and many other states. We have less than an month left to fix this and still no progress.



So lets move forward, what do we do from this point? Are we willing to stand united and fight this or take what we have been given like usual? The past is the past, it is time to stand up and stand together. We have a lot of intelligent people in this industry now we need them all in one room with one consensus.
kurthumphrey is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 06:07 AM   #2
 
  Sep 2012
  Clear Lake, Iowa
http://www.cwd-info.org/index.php/fu...1613f1d6a42a60



The above link will provide you the answer for Wildlife having input for regulating our industry. Its really quite simple.



Most industry people are uninformed.
Rhonda Brakke is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 06:24 AM   #3
 
  Sep 2012
  Clear Lake, Iowa
http://s1274.photobucket.com/user/br...59a6a.jpg.html



I see that Dr. Klein's CV has now been removed from the CWD Alliance website, however, I happened to save a copy for your review.
Rhonda Brakke is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 06:45 AM   #4
 
  Jul 2010
  petersburg, Michigan
Rhonda that photobucket link shows up as an error and cannot be found. Hmmmm?
stepheck is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 06:56 AM   #5
 
  Apr 2009
  Poplar Bluff, Missouri
Try this link



http://s1274.photobucket.com/user/br...59a6a.jpg.html
kurthumphrey is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 07:02 AM   #6
 Four Seasons Whitetails's Avatar
 
  Oct 2009
  upstate ny

Cervid: Whitetail Deer
Quote:
Originally Posted by kurthumphrey
The federal standards were written by wildlife. Wildlife were immediately exempted from the document. That is just like obamacare, they impose a healthcare plan for the rest of the country but the government don't want the plan to pertain to them.?? We all know that these rules and standards that everyone keeps saying WE ask for were written to put us out of business. NADEFA wants to keep the borders to all states open and their ideal when this started is to open up texas for business to the north. So they pushed for this federal rule were everyone could operate under the same rules. Meanwhile the states adopt methods to pretty much keep everyone on the same field and trade is better than ever without FEDERAL REGULATION!! At USAHA in october patty klein showed a set of standards that was to put guidance to the rule that was already adopted. Nadefa executive director was ok with them being put out for comment then. He said that we can get them in place and fix them later, but charly and laurie were there to object and that is when the working group was formed to fix this detrimental document. I am name throwing stones at anyone, nor am i praising anyone but just telling the real story. We have went months working and working without any progress, even the state vets are saying the document is flawed beyond repair. In a private meeting with clifford charley was told that we could throw out the standards if the entire industry support and the state vets was on board. This would mean coming back to the table WITHOUT WILDLIFE. When that announcement was make everyone made charly out to be a liar, and that is total bullshit. Charly, Laurie and Eric have lost a lot of skin trying to help the cervid industry while NADEFA have tried everything to persecuted them for it! So we didn't take the opportunity to throw out the standards and pushed forward to exhaust all options with negotiations. For some reason we have the idea that these USDA people are out friends and we are going to all sit around have hold hands after this is over! So we thought that we are going to make some kinda progress on the DC trip. At the meeting clifford told us that this working group will conclude in 60 days and it was going to comment. There will be no pulling it back at that point and now we have showed that we are divided and blown every opportunity to get rid of this document. We are too damn stupid to listen to more than one person, shawn has had the lead this whole time and now we going to get a document that is going put us out of business. How long do we last when we test 100% of the animals and wildlife test less than 1%. They will point the finger at us until the public runs us out of town!! It is already happening in florida and many other states. We have less than an month left to fix this and still no progress.



So lets move forward, what do we do from this point? Are we willing to stand united and fight this or take what we have been given like usual? The past is the past, it is time to stand up and stand together. We have a lot of intelligent people in this industry now we need them all in one room with one consensus.


So you think a guy,or people i should say that have skin in this game and own hundreds of deer on their farms are going to do something or knowingly let something happen to shut themselves down and put them out of business!

Is this correct?
Four Seasons Whitetails is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 07:03 AM   #7
 
  Apr 2009
  Fombell PA
Kurt,

Awesome post! And right to the point....you laid it all out for everyone to understand......i still feel we need to explore our options with a Lawyer at this point.....our industry is being forced into a corner with no other options as I see it........we can't continue to allow ourselves to be treated unfairly any longer!!!



mike, I don't think those he was speaking of knowingly thought the path they were taking would lead to where it is now......
ddwhitetails is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 09:19 AM   #8
 
  Apr 2009
  TN
Quote:
Originally Posted by kurthumphrey
The federal standards were written by wildlife. Wildlife were immediately exempted from the document. That is just like obamacare, they impose a healthcare plan for the rest of the country but the government don't want the plan to pertain to them.?? We all know that these rules and standards that everyone keeps saying WE ask for were written to put us out of business. NADEFA wants to keep the borders to all states open and their ideal when this started is to open up texas for business to the north. So they pushed for this federal rule were everyone could operate under the same rules. Meanwhile the states adopt methods to pretty much keep everyone on the same field and trade is better than ever without FEDERAL REGULATION!! At USAHA in october patty klein showed a set of standards that was to put guidance to the rule that was already adopted. Nadefa executive director was ok with them being put out for comment then. He said that we can get them in place and fix them later, but charly and laurie were there to object and that is when the working group was formed to fix this detrimental document. I am name throwing stones at anyone, nor am i praising anyone but just telling the real story. We have went months working and working without any progress, even the state vets are saying the document is flawed beyond repair. In a private meeting with clifford charley was told that we could throw out the standards if the entire industry support and the state vets was on board. This would mean coming back to the table WITHOUT WILDLIFE. When that announcement was make everyone made charly out to be a liar, and that is total bullshit. Charly, Laurie and Eric have lost a lot of skin trying to help the cervid industry while NADEFA have tried everything to persecuted them for it! So we didn't take the opportunity to throw out the standards and pushed forward to exhaust all options with negotiations. For some reason we have the idea that these USDA people are out friends and we are going to all sit around have hold hands after this is over! So we thought that we are going to make some kinda progress on the DC trip. At the meeting clifford told us that this working group will conclude in 60 days and it was going to comment. There will be no pulling it back at that point and now we have showed that we are divided and blown every opportunity to get rid of this document. We are too damn stupid to listen to more than one person, shawn has had the lead this whole time and now we going to get a document that is going put us out of business. How long do we last when we test 100% of the animals and wildlife test less than 1%. They will point the finger at us until the public runs us out of town!! It is already happening in florida and many other states. We have less than an month left to fix this and still no progress.



So lets move forward, what do we do from this point? Are we willing to stand united and fight this or take what we have been given like usual? The past is the past, it is time to stand up and stand together. We have a lot of intelligent people in this industry now we need them all in one room with one consensus.


Kurt, Please see below as I think this will help explain the situation more in detail. Pay close attention to what is red in color.



Kurt, What Dr. Clifford told me in an email was: "What I said was that I wanted to hear the concerns if the industry and the States. I did not say that the rule would be withdrawn. The National Assembly is going to print a correction."



******************************************



Message Title: Cervid Industry & State Vets Could Rewrite Federal

Author: Eric Mohlman Posted: 03\29\2013 10:12

Location: NE

Message: Good News From the ACA



The American Cervid Alliance (ACA) received word today that the National Assembly of State Veterinarians, during their regularly scheduled meeting, gave support to industry in possibly eliminating the federal CWD program consisting of the current Federal Rule and Federal Program Standards. The supporting assembly members are in favor of doing away with these arduous rules designed to put the cervid industry out of business and starting over with a new set of rules written by industry and state animal health officials.



The three national cervid associations, North American Deer Farmers Association (NADeFA), Exotic Wildlife Association (EWA), and North American Elk Breeders Association (NAEBA), along with several members of the National Assembly of State Veterinarians, if approved by a majority vote of the ACA on April 9th *, will work to rewrite rules that will be acceptable to not only the cervid breeders but also the nation's state animal health agencies. This would be the cervid industry's program that would govern all interstate movement of CWD susceptible species. Also if approved by the ACA, wildlife agencies will not be included in this new rule making process.



Dr. John Clifford, head of USDA/ APHIS, is supportive of the cervid industry and has indicated that he would support this effort to develop our own program. This is a golden opportunity to reduce the federal CWD regulations and it is imperative that we stand united.



*Don’t forget to send in your association’s ACA representative so that your vote will be counted on April 9th .
Autry is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 10:13 AM   #9
 
  Apr 2009
  Poplar Bluff, Missouri
David, I am not here to debate what has happened that has caused us to be in our present situation. You have made it very evident where you stand. The political fighting is what has us here. Lets be productive and offer a solution.
kurthumphrey is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 10:13 AM   #10
 
  Sep 2012
  Clear Lake, Iowa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Autry
Kurt, Please see below as I think this will help explain the situation more in detail. Pay close attention to what is red in color.



Kurt, What Dr. Clifford told me in an email was: "What I said was that I wanted to hear the concerns if the industry and the States. I did not say that the rule would be withdrawn. The National Assembly is going to print a correction."



******************************************



Message Title: Cervid Industry & State Vets Could Rewrite Federal

Author: Eric Mohlman Posted: 03\29\2013 10:12

Location: NE

Message: Good News From the ACA



The American Cervid Alliance (ACA) received word today that the National Assembly of State Veterinarians, during their regularly scheduled meeting, gave support to industry in possibly eliminating the federal CWD program consisting of the current Federal Rule and Federal Program Standards. The supporting assembly members are in favor of doing away with these arduous rules designed to put the cervid industry out of business and starting over with a new set of rules written by industry and state animal health officials.



The three national cervid associations, North American Deer Farmers Association (NADeFA), Exotic Wildlife Association (EWA), and North American Elk Breeders Association (NAEBA), along with several members of the National Assembly of State Veterinarians, if approved by a majority vote of the ACA on April 9th *, will work to rewrite rules that will be acceptable to not only the cervid breeders but also the nation's state animal health agencies. This would be the cervid industry's program that would govern all interstate movement of CWD susceptible species. Also if approved by the ACA, wildlife agencies will not be included in this new rule making process.



Dr. John Clifford, head of USDA/ APHIS, is supportive of the cervid industry and has indicated that he would support this effort to develop our own program. This is a golden opportunity to reduce the federal CWD regulations and it is imperative that we stand united.



*Don’t forget to send in your association’s ACA representative so that your vote will be counted on April 9th .


David, Would you be so kind as to leave Eric out of this? He's grieving the loss of his mother. Obviously Eric and you want the same thing according to your earlier posts.



Lets be team players, please.
Rhonda Brakke is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 11:12 AM   #11
 
  Apr 2009
  TN
Quote:
Originally Posted by kurthumphrey
David, I am not here to debate what has happened that has caused us to be in our present situation. You have made it very evident where you stand. The political fighting is what has us here. Lets be productive and offer a solution.


Kurt,



It is not political fighting that has us here where we are today. It is untruthful and misleading information that has us here. Because of that, we now probably have only one solution, litigation.
Autry is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 11:14 AM   #12
 
  Apr 2009
  TN
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhonda Brakke
David, Would you be so kind as to leave Eric out of this? He's grieving the loss of his mother. Obviously Eric and you want the same thing according to your earlier posts.



Lets be team players, please.


I'm sorry to hear about Eric's mother.
Autry is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 11:47 AM   #13
 
  Apr 2009
  Poplar Bluff, Missouri
Quote:
Originally Posted by Autry
Kurt,



It is not political fighting that has us here where we are today. It is untruthful and misleading information that has us here. Because of that, we now probably have only one solution, litigation.


I guess that same misleading information decided to decline the help of the state vets to draft an alternative copy from scratch too right? I listened to dr hartman offer help on two different calls, but we elected to exhaust all options. We elected to negotiate til the end and tell the state vets that we will call them if we needed them. There was such a power struggle going on that the focus of the standards was lost in the whole mess. Now we are left with the effects of that and will have to decide what direction we will choose.
kurthumphrey is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 12:28 PM   #14
 
  Apr 2009
  TN
Kurt,



I agree, too much emphasis was put on raising funds and getting new members instead of concentrating on the CWD and other problems. It appears now that some were willing to claim they had more support than they actually had, and in my opinion, these misleading and untruthful statements was an attempt to get more funds and more support. Many in this industry, based their decision on who to believe and who to follow, on this misleading and untruthful information.



All this is in the past and we can't change any of it so it serves no point and is a waste of time to rehash this. I'm not sure why this thread was started. I think many agree, litigation may be our only solution at this point.
Autry is offline  
Old May 9th 2013, 01:20 PM   #15
 
  Nov 2012
  Havre, Montana
Quote:
Originally Posted by Autry
Kurt,



It is not political fighting that has us here where we are today. It is untruthful and misleading information that has us here. Because of that, we now probably have only one solution, litigation.


David

This is where you are wrong.The division of our industry started long before. Where we are today was caused by one thing,those that want to accept the rule and standards as written and work on it later,those that want to fix it first or get rid of it and start over.It's really that simple. Coming from Montana after 20 years of battling the enemies of our industry I have learned that their plan is two things 1. elimination by regulation 2.Prey on the uninformed public. So which way should we go give them 60+ pages of regulation or fix the problem.Because of our division fixing the problem might not now be an option.I guess we will see on the 20TH



Kim Kafka

NAEBA President
Kim Kafka is offline  
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