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Old Feb 3rd 2010, 04:24 PM   #16
 Wild Rivers Whitetails's Avatar
 
  Apr 2009
  Northeast Wisconsin

Cervid: Deer Farming
I understand that things take time and you can't always have it all at once. Maybe if the federal government ever passes some CWD rules - that is before we all die of old age - some of the states with closed borders will have to open them if they adopt the federal rules. Like I said earlier - no other agricultural industry has this kind of restriction that I am aware of - what happened to free commerce?? I know, I know - CWD - just an excuse as we all know.
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Old Feb 3rd 2010, 05:04 PM   #17
 
  Mar 2009
  Blairstown, LA
There is more to our industry being highly regulated than CWD or any other disease. DNR's do not want to give up the power they have when it comes to deer. They can't see beyond their proverbial noses. They truly believe they can regulate us out of business and their hunting license revenues will rise.
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Old Feb 3rd 2010, 06:00 PM   #18
 
  Dec 2009
  Henryetta,OK
I am not familiar with Mississippi deer farming at all or anything to do with it, so this may be a stupid question. If you guys are working to get deer farming legal in Mississippi, does that mean there are pen deer there already that are not legal? The thing I dont understand is if deer farming is not legal and they cannot import deer, where do the deer come from to start the farms?
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Old Feb 3rd 2010, 06:35 PM   #19
 
  Apr 2009
  Alabaster, Alabama
I am a deer breeder in Alabama and can tell you first hand the price being asked for grade deer in this state is out of sight.A grade no pedigree doe will bring 3500.00,don't even think of buying one that has any kind of pedigree.Mississippi needs to first get deer breeding legalized and then get their borders opened as soon as possible to avoid the false market before it starts.
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Old Feb 3rd 2010, 06:45 PM   #20
 
  Mar 2009
  Blairstown, LA
Brandon,

WT deer in Mississippi have always been considered a state resource and therefore are property of the state. "Deer Farms" do not now, nor have they ever existed legally in MS. Enclosures have been legal for exotics, but native WT only deer enclosures were not allowed. Having said that, some people with generally large acre tracts erected high fences, some for the addition of exotics, some just so they could manage the natural deer herds on their property. In 2005 the MDWFP passed legislation giving them the right to regulate these private enclosures. Their regulations prohibited any enclosures less than 300 acres for WT deer. This caused people with smaller enclosures 40-299 acres to have to remove the WT deer from their enclosures. So deer farming (breeder operations) could not exist. In 2006 the SGRA was able to get regulations changed that allowed breeder operations inside permitted 300+acre enclosures. In addition, we also got the right to AI deer within these breeder enclosures. After a couple of rounds of AI the next natural question was who owns the AI offspring? This started a firestorm with the outcome in favor of the deer farmer. Since Ms is a closed border state, we were able to to get regulations that allowed transfer of deer between permitted enclosures. However, the sale of deer in MS was still prohibited. The bill we are speaking about here would allow sale of WT deer from one enclosure to another and allow small (5ac) breeder enclosures to be legal. Now the small enclosures will be able to buy from the large enclosures, thus that is how they would get their deer, until we can get the borders open later on down the line. We are approaching this challenge with a "baby step" mentality. Confused yet?





Will,

I'm glad to hear AL is beginning to grow its deer industry. You say "1.)fastest growing agriculture industry in the state". Did you guys get the regulatory agency changed to agriculture? I thought the dept. of conservation regulated the WT deer indutry in AL. Congrats if you did!



I believe the exotic folks over there are having a time getting new permits because the dept. of conservation isn't issuing any more non-indiginous species permits. Is that true?



I am a little confused as well as to how AL's cwd program works too. I understand it is administered by the state Ag dept, and a brand new deer farmer will be able to get a CWD accreditation of 7years after April of this year. Explain how that works, I too would like that to be something we try to achieve in Mississippi.
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Old Feb 3rd 2010, 07:15 PM   #21
 
  Jun 2009
Scott,

In Alabama we are regulated by Ag for disease issues and conservation for permitting. Call me and i will explain how we went about getting the CWD program going. I think you could do the same thing in Miss.
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Old Feb 3rd 2010, 07:15 PM   #22
 
  Jun 2009
2563021724...cell call me anytime
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Old Feb 4th 2010, 05:43 AM   #23
 
  Apr 2009
  Clanton, Alabama
Deer Farming in Alabama is not an Agriculture Industry it is regulated by Game & Fish. I wish it was Agriculture Industrial maybe someday it will be. Hey I just had a good thought, maybe we should we have some kind of survey of all the deer breeders and see if they want to leave it under Game & fish or make it the fastest growning Agriculture Industrial in the State.



By the way, I would like to remind you if you get something asking you to take a pole on if you want it under Game & Fish or Agriculture, Game & Fish would defintaly keep boarders closed as they are now. Agriculture would definatly open the boarders, which one would you like?
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Old Feb 4th 2010, 05:44 AM   #24
 Rick's Avatar
 
  Apr 2009
  West Salem, Ohio

Cervid: Whitetails
I am not involved in what you guys are trying to do in Mississippi but would like to say Thank You to those that are. Thank you for your time, commitmnet, dedication, money spent, and skills/experience, that has been spent in working on this.



I know that deer farming is flourshing in Alabama and that Will, Ricky, and others have spent allot of all the above to make that a reality, Great Job we will all benifit from your efforts...
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Old Feb 4th 2010, 09:10 AM   #25
 
  Apr 2009
  Nowata, OK
Easy now Jason, we have to live with him down here. One thing about Tim, you know where he stands. Thats why we keep him. He is a good voice for the industry.
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Old Feb 4th 2010, 01:45 PM   #26
 richie0033's Avatar
 
  May 2009
  Tuscaloosa, Alabama

Cervid: Whitetail Deer
I know that the deer business was bad in 2002.. That's when most of everyone in the south started getting interested in it. Maybe some in 2003. But everything goes in cycles. I'm not saying that the people in the south made the deer business rebound but we did spend alot of money over the past few years. The fact is the deer business is a business. I don't see any breeders in the north telling Will or Ricky that they don't want their money. I personally think they sometimes pay the breeders in the north WAY to much for their deer. But nobody ever tells them "hey I think you paid to much for my deer so let me give you some money back" because in my "heart" I feel I should. I know that those two and others have stimulated the northern deer breeders very well. All the records for deer sales have been broke over the years and both of them have helped break them. All I am saying is don't bite the hand that feeds you. Everyone can bitch and moan about the deer business but if someone comes to your farm with enough money I don't think anyone would tell them no!!! Because in my heart I can't. You would sell for as much as you could get. Free Enterprise!!
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Old Feb 4th 2010, 02:04 PM   #27
 
  Mar 2009
  Blairstown, LA
I agree with Jason.

Tim,

As usual you have used your keen insight to wade through the bull and call it like it is. No wonder you write such good songs! Thanks
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Old Feb 4th 2010, 02:10 PM   #28
 richie0033's Avatar
 
  May 2009
  Tuscaloosa, Alabama

Cervid: Whitetail Deer
Also as far as the borders go I think that they should stay closed. If you look at Texas the deer business is strong. They can sell their does at a good price. Most of the farmers that have what you would call "average deer" up north cannot sell their does. They have to eat them. These does will raise 200" four year olds but because they are not the elite does nobody wants them. That is not what I want in the south. That doe should be worth money not meat. All does should have a place in the deer business. Not everyone can afford elite deer. If you flood the market the deer will not be worth nothing. If the borders are opened it will flood the market just like up north then we will be eating our does. If our deer are not worth anything thing we don't have an incentive to keep spending money on upgrading our herd. (buying semen, does, bucks, or fawns). No need for us to build enclosures because nobody ever wants to invest in something with zero return. I think that the states with the closed borders are more stable in the deer industry because of it. Texas deer sales ate up and they continue to be stable. Most breeders up north couldn't sell their deer this year and they are scared. Do you think they want to go out and spend more money in the deer business. NO!!!!! this hurts everybody.
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Old Feb 4th 2010, 02:20 PM   #29
 
  Mar 2009
  Blairstown, LA
I understand the financial advantages of closed borders. Without the ability to go outside the state to buy deer, you are forced to buy "in-house" and thus the suppliers can virtually name their prices. Great gig for the suppliers, but eventually the bubble will burst. When the demand goes down the suppliers will be forced to lower their prices. What I can't get a handle on is why would a state that does not allow importation of deer also allow their exportation? Why would anyone that has deer in a closed state want to export them? Surely the prices of deer exported, cannot be anywhere near the prices you could get in the "captive market", so why even allow exportation? If you as a supplier of deer in a closed border state are exporting them, then how can you justify the loss of income from selling the deer cheaper? If you are having to export them, then what does that say about the demand and the stability of the industry there?



Some of you may want to fill in the blanks for me.
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Old Feb 5th 2010, 12:33 PM   #30
 
  Mar 2009
  Blairstown, LA
Back to the rediculous...........Will all AL deer farmers will enjoy a 7yr CWD status beginning this April. The state is grandfathering them into the program. How on gods green earth is one of those 32 new deer farmers going to have a 7 yr status when their farms haven't been in existance that long? I realize AL bagan testing wild deer in 2002/2003, but they didn't begin testing farmed cervids until just recently. In addition to that, how can a deer farmer that is allowed to bring exotics into the state, allowed to have a separate CWD status for his WT's if they are kept in the same enclosure? In Louisiana, your CWD status is exactly that YOUR status, not that of the dept of conservation's wild deer survey results. I am not complaining that you guys got that for your farms, just curious as to how much it cost and who had to be bribed to get something that absurd enacted.
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