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Old May 15th 2014, 07:56 AM   #1
 
  May 2014
  NY


Alittle back story... I "acquired" two adult bucks (7 years and 4 years) from a bad situation. Poor nutrition(they were being fed corn and apples), lack of worming protocol, etc... It was an emergency situation so they were transferred in (up to date on TB testing) and quarantined. They came in with diarrhea* and terrible bristle coats. They*were being kept in a*marshy area with clay for soil and farm fowl (chickens, etc). While they were down for transport they were given an injection of ivomec plus and*oral panacur as well as baytril. They had a lot of matter in their eyes and nose and swelling along the*jaw in addition to labored breathing*after waking from sedation.*I was able to*get them thru that. *Well, who knew that they would bust THROUGH (peeled it back like a sardine can) the chain link fence to get in with the rest of the herd. GAH!

Fast forward*over a*month.... I am STILL battling diarrhea with them and have lost a yearling (from the same location) which broke with mucousy diarrhea , then bloody diarrhea then death within 10 days. Findings upon necropsy were : pneumonia, lesions on the liver (NOT T , and ruptured intestines as well as a lobe of the liver that was so infested with thread-like worms that it was dead. (Remember that this came from the same location as the other adult bucks)

I was able to segregate some of the herd but they kept working the fence so it seemed like an expensive effort in futility to keep them completely quarantined. So, within the few that are with them they have passed the diarrhea around. With my deer , if I catch the diarrhea within 24 hours of when it starts and treat with an injection of baytril and an injection of C&D antitoxin they are right as rain. But I'll be darned if I cant clear the two older bucks of the diarrhea. Even the vets are stumped!

Here is the run down: Original fecal test showed - liver flukes, lung worm, coccidia . They were treated and now have negative fecals.

matter in the eyes has cleared (mostly)

Respiratory signs have cleared (no more labored breathing or coughing)

What they have been treated with- wormers - Albendazole, ivomec +,* corid, metronidazole, panacur

Antibiotics - Baytril (only one that seems to make a difference), neomycin, primor (sulpha drug), pen G, tetracycline

They have also gotten- banamine, meloxicam ( anti-inflammatory), c&d antitoxin, tagament, probiotics , electrolyes,

Diet - hay (timothy / alfalfa ) , purina pellets, small amount of corn, browse, calf mana and I have offered hay stretcher for fiber but have discontinued that.

There may be more that Im missing... Im a bit frazzled.


The ONLY thing that seems to help is the c&d antitoxin and baytril daily. And that only gets me from complete unpredictable projectile water poops, to pudding plops , not normal pellets. Ive tried pulling them off of everything for 24 hours to see if that helped and I ended up back to square one!

They eat well, body condition is ok (other than the coat and the younger bucks hooves are EXTREMELY over grown, but I associate that with liver damage), they are growing racks and the older buck now trots alittle. The one with the over grown hooves looks the worst, he has been persistently "frizzed" since he came.

Im spending about 16 hours a day on these deer,and waaayy too much $$$. Im looking for suggestions....I feel like Im beating my head against the wall. Fawn season is coming and I MUST get this figured out before then!

Please help before I go completely over the edge!!! lol




*
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Old May 15th 2014, 10:18 AM   #2
 RyanR's Avatar
 
  May 2010
  Stevens Point/Gillett, WI


Since you have thrown the "book" at them I am wondering if these animals are suffering from acidosis caused from an all corn diet like you mentioned. I would try some corrid in their water because coccidia can be tough to get rid of, especially if avian are present. These may or may not show up on fecals either. Another possible issue could be Giardia, which is hardly ever looked for in fecal samples unless specified. Giardia can be killed off with a safeguard regiment. If you would like to talk over the phone give me a call 608-669-6185. Ryan
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Old May 15th 2014, 10:35 AM   #3
 
  May 2014
  NY


Thank you*for the reply Ryan! Ive thrown the entire library at them! lol

*They were on Corrid for 10 days and metronidazole (treats giardia) for 10 days as well. Im going to recheck a fecal today, once I can catch a fresh sample. Poor guys are getting pretty shy about pooping now, since Im always watching them.
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Old May 15th 2014, 10:36 AM   #4
 
  May 2014
  NY


So, with acidosis what would be the best treatment?
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Old May 15th 2014, 10:50 AM   #5
 RyanR's Avatar
 
  May 2010
  Stevens Point/Gillett, WI


From my experience there really isn't a treatment for it. Animals will get better (have pellets) and then as hormones change or stress increases the wet pattys return. The best success I have had is to place the animals on a Tylan and*panacur treatment. Tylan tightens the gut up and panacur is a dewormer, so if your fecals are negative maybe just use the Tylan. We use a soybean treat feed to add the tylan into the diet, its a powder and is easily concealed! Hope I am helping a little!
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Old May 15th 2014, 10:57 AM   #6
 
  May 2014
  NY


aaahhh!! Wonderful! So, you use the tylan powder? (not the injectable) And what dose do you use?
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Old May 15th 2014, 10:58 AM   #7
 
  May 2014
  NY


You are helping ALOT!*
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Old May 15th 2014, 11:15 AM   #8
 
  May 2014
  NY


the dose I have is 10mg/kg (for sheep and goats) .. do you know if the injectable can be used orally?
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Old May 15th 2014, 11:28 AM   #9
 Four Seasons Whitetails's Avatar
 
  Oct 2009
  upstate ny

Cervid: Whitetail Deer
Valbazen ASAP! Follow directions on the bottle. The adult liver flukes may have been killed but not the young ones. You have to do segments to kill them all!!! I would load them up with fiber. Dry hay!!! No corn what so ever! They sound like they have 9 lives after all they have been through. Valbazen will do wonders fri them boyz! Good Luck!!
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Old May 15th 2014, 11:30 AM   #10
 Four Seasons Whitetails's Avatar
 
  Oct 2009
  upstate ny

Cervid: Whitetail Deer
And don't forget the important probiotics! Get there gut alive again after all these meds!!!!!
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Old May 15th 2014, 11:35 AM   #11
 
  May 2014
  NY


Thank you Four Seasons.Yes!*I do believe they are part feline! Every day I go out expecting to see them down. The older guy went down the first week and I was able to get an IV in and give him fluide but he rebounded quickly and*has made it very difficult to get meds in him since.

*They have been dosed with Valbazen (albendazole) ,but only once so far approx. 10 days ago.Should I Redose even with a neg fecal?

. I will stop the little corn they are getting. They have fresh hay (all they want) .
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Old May 15th 2014, 11:42 AM   #12
 Four Seasons Whitetails's Avatar
 
  Oct 2009
  upstate ny

Cervid: Whitetail Deer
My bad. I missed that one!! I believe I would treat them again but know its about getting their gut back healthy. Shock effect products or any really their gut has to bees shed up at this point. Get it in their water and maybe top dress some pellets mixed with a little oil of some kind to get it to stick to the pellets!
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Old May 15th 2014, 12:57 PM   #13
 RyanR's Avatar
 
  May 2010
  Stevens Point/Gillett, WI


Yes I use the powder, I am not sure of the injectable usages myself. I do use the goat dosage as well!
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Old May 15th 2014, 01:07 PM   #14
 Bell's Avatar
 
  Apr 2014
  Greensburg, IN
Agree with Ry-O & Mike cut almost all the grain. DigestaMax4 made by Vigortone is a great product for digestive health. It is a high quality product made for the dairy industry so it is sold at a much more sensible price than similar products marketed for deer. It is possible in the poor environment they were in they could have eaten synthetic baling strings, shade clothe, etc. and could have blockages. Have any of your deer caught the root beer fountain symptoms? The bloody scours generally indicates coccidiosis. Besides running corrid in the water temporarily you may also add deccox continually in their feed. I assume you would have said if the one necropsied with the ruptured bowel had a foreign object inside like baling string? EHD also can permanently make a deer's rumen not function properly and they will always have diarrhea no matter what you do. Does the one with long toes have rings or ridges around its hooves? I would also try worming them with Long Range. This is an example of why we don't offer live breedings and very rarely buy a new deer and bring it to our farm. We generally outcross our bloodlines by AI.

Good luck
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Old May 16th 2014, 02:54 AM   #15
 
  Apr 2009
  Belvidere, NJ


Have you treated for coccidia?
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