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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 06:39 PM   #1
 
  Jul 2010
  Broken Bow Okla
Needing any and all information on this asap....



Buck fawn is walking in circles, repetitive circles in one spot. walks with head sort of down and favors left side. is lethargic but will walk around daily. jaw is off set some. no visible knots or wounds. no dehyrdration. We administered 4/10 cc excede & 1/2 cc draxin, B1000, honey from a syringe, pedialyte & fawn paste 2 days ago. he does seem some what better today but still circles bad along with the obvious signs he doesnt feel good. We have been told it could possibly be an inner ear infection. Has anyone experienced these types of symptoms in any of their deer? It seems the "inner ear" speculation is the most plausable cause of his problems?! HELP!
cloudycr is offline  
Old Jul 2nd 2011, 07:06 PM   #2
 
  Apr 2009
  New York
How old? Is he walking or stumbling? Is he in obvious pain or just not feeling well? Is the jaw tight when you gave him the honey? Did his mouth/tongue feel cool or cold when you opened his mouth? If the jaw is offset, is he grinding his teeth in pain? Are the eyes alert or dull looking? Ears up or down? Sorry for all the questions--just trying to get a better picture of what's going on.

Draxxin is great for many things, and should help with/prevent pneumonia, but would straight penicillin, (in addition), work better on an ear infection?
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 07:25 PM   #3
 
  Jul 2010
  Broken Bow Okla
He was born 5-19 so about a 1 1/2 months old. He is walking with no stumbling. To be more specific, in my words, I would say, accompanied with the repeated cirlces he does throughout the day is more of a vertigo(ish) rather than what Id refer to as"stumbling". Id hate to say stumbling simply because it doesnt strike me as stumbling! He just doesnt feel well! Very accurate on that. His Jaw was Not tight when we administered the honey. He did drink down the pedialyte as if he hadnt eaten in some time. So that gave us a good sign he was infact still "alive". His tongue did not feel cold or cool to touch. His tongue was nice and pink, gums pink, nose was wet and eyes were alert looking. No teeth grinding at all. Ears are neither up nor down. It appears to me that he is tilting his head as if favoring his left side (head or ear).

Thanks for the questions....we are in this together...lol...

We have administered draxxin & excede both. With both "should" have cleared any infection up but I have been told that childrens inner ear drops would help with this in the event it is an inner ear infection! We have not given penicillin as of yet but would not want to over dose him with antibiotics at the same time!
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 07:30 PM   #4
 
  Jul 2010
  Broken Bow Okla
Robert,

we were actually told today that he had a 2 yr old buck that did this, with the circles acting crazy to an extent, and looked physically healthy...he favored the infected ear..and even actually went blind due to not knowing this was the issue at hand thus for not being treated in a timely manner caused the blindness...Too Ironic that you say that about the blind factor! Makes me really think this is whats wrong with our fawn...I had mentioned to my husband that he looked like he couldnt see very well but heck he sure is swift on his feet when we get close!!!!! lol! Maybe thats just nature!
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 07:39 PM   #5
 
  Jul 2010
  Broken Bow Okla
My husband says he is NOT blind..just confirmed this with him!
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 07:40 PM   #6
 La. Bone Collector's Avatar
 
  Aug 2009
  Winnsboro, LA
Sounds neurological to me! He could have possible spinal/head trauma? Just guessing. I would administer banamine as well-Jason
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 07:44 PM   #7
 
  Jul 2010
  Broken Bow Okla
Bone Collector-

since there are no obvious signs of trauma spinal or head, what could be going on since he looks perfectly healthy externally i.e. not under weight, dehydrated etc.. I mean what could have caused this to happen? I know this makes me sound so uneducated but honestly if I dont ask "stupid" questions I wont know!
cloudycr is offline  
Old Jul 2nd 2011, 07:50 PM   #8
 
  Apr 2009
  Amsterdam, Ohio
Possible listeria ? Circling disease !! Is his neck kinda cocked to one side ? I`ve only seen one like this and treated with tetradure and banamine for a few days and she pulled out of it !! Not sure if this is your problem but sounds familiar . Do a search on listeria or circling disease .
Mitch P is offline  
Old Jul 2nd 2011, 07:55 PM   #9
 
  Apr 2009
  New York
Fom Whitetail Quest



Blindness

Many times the blindness can be reversed with a good antibiotic therapy. Use Penicillin G at 1.5cc sub-Q dosage rates for 5 consecutive days on fawns with bacterial infections that settle in their eyes (generally detectable by a blue opaque pigment) with great success. It is important to remember to use probias or yogurt during the treatment period to maintain bacterial growth in the rumen.



IF the fawn is merely circling or "dazed" it could be thiamine deficient instead of blind. This can happen after deworming or if the animal is still "polluted" with parasites. (Have a fecal sample checked!) Vitamin B-Complex-Plus high in thiamine will normally correct this condition. your hint re: worming set the cure in motion.

Give up to 3cc of VITAMIN B12 1000MCG INJECTION, w/12.5 thiamine. If the animal's need is for thiamine, top dressing pelleted food with Brewer's Yeast will help.
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 07:56 PM   #10
 La. Bone Collector's Avatar
 
  Aug 2009
  Winnsboro, LA
I'm with Mitch on meds. Reduce swelling and see if there is improvement. Bose is not out of order either!
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 08:12 PM   #11
 
  Jul 2010
  Broken Bow Okla
Mitch- Hmmm....Thats interesting and makes this sitiation alot more complex than what we had been thinking! This listeria is horrible! My next question is, how in the world could you possibly know what to treat this fawn for with so many similarities and wide range of symptoms? I feel hopeful but helpless at the same time! All of these symptoms sound like the issue too he and his twin brother were born 2 weeks early making me think if in fact its Listeria, was passed down from the mother Invetro. Right? or at least I think thats what I understood can happen?!
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 08:17 PM   #12
 
  Jul 2010
  Broken Bow Okla
Makes sense. At least on the thiamine or treatment to correct the difeciency. So many factors to consider. Something has to work. or at least what we have done thus far has kept him alive? How soon should we see results?
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 08:33 PM   #13
 
  Jul 2010
  Broken Bow Okla
Since we are on the subject of worming...My husband and I are worming with safeguard paste. How many CC's do we give our month old bottle fed fawns? and it is ok to mix the paste in their bottles or give it straight in their mouth with out dilution!?
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Old Jul 2nd 2011, 10:02 PM   #14
 
  Apr 2009
Had a fawn this morning with the same symptoms. Circling and acting drunk like. I Took to the vet which is a great deer and goat vet. He told me either goat polio or listeria. I have given the B Complex at 5cc morning and night with some improvement. Also gave 1.5 cc of Nuflor which vet says will cross the brain stem. Vet says that is the only drug he has had any success with crossing the brain stem. If Goat polio should get better with in 5-7 days gradually. My vet says if Listeria, will more than likely die in a week or maybe a little longer. I have never seen this in 4 yrs of raising deer. Fawn will still take bottle and looks otherwise healthy. Ears up, not dehydrated, etc. Kind has me wondering what would have caused this. I have read all I can on both symptoms, just can't see where this comes in to play. Fawn is 6 weeks old and weighs 27.6 pounds. Huge fawn, well nourished and eats like a beast.
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Old Jul 3rd 2011, 12:00 AM   #15
 
  Jul 2010
  Broken Bow Okla
Midwest- I had previously read up on Polio & Tetnus too. Seemed to be of some interest in our case this year. With this being our first official fawning season dont know what to expect quite yet. So of course, ONLY with illness comes all the overwhelming flow of diseases which could POSSIBLY kill one or all of our stock at ANY given time! Sort of discouraging for a first year deer farmer to see what lay ahead esp. with fawns!



With that said, We have been (knock on wood) fortunate thus far only losing 2 full term fawns (twin doe fawns) that we opted to leave on their mother, first one of the 2 died @ 3 days old with no warning what so ever. literally fine mid day then around 4 pm found her gasping for breath and dead by the time we got her in the house! HAVE NO clue what happened there. 3 weeks later the other twin, after watching her like a hawk, went from fine that morning running around playing to me walking the pin out, noticing she had formed 2 knots on the sides of her cheek bones and was bloated bad, lethagic, eyes sunk in, noce dry, dehyrdated & literally all but DEAD. We did everything in our power to get her back with fluids, penicillin, paste etc...but by 3 am that morning she was gone! It was then I didnt sleep for 2 days straight because I was up online reading anything I could about what caused this to happen.....everything ran together or at least had the same initial on sight symptoms so how in the world could I say what it was or what caused this?! SOOO FRUSTRATING!

We have used every precautionary measure necessary to make sure we are covered way before these fawns got here including getting any and all meds necessary, emergency wise all we were lacking was Saline and a few odds and ends but Damn, if when they first start arriving are not responding to what we are giving them to PREVENT illness then what else can we do but sit back and pray most of them survive and hold our tears in when we lose half!?!

I am not sure whats wrong with this buck fawn. The more I am reading these posts about neurological problems, the more Im leaning towards what I initially thought it was either polio, tetnus or inner ear infection. Listeria seems way too complex and I truly dont even understand how to prevent it from not killing everything we have on our farm IF its infact whats caused his problems! At this point, I am restless and dont know what to do! All of the "vets" around this area are IGNORANT to deer ingeneral and wont even offer assistance over the phone or in home since they dont know anything about deer illness or cures for their illnesses!

Thanks for the responces! It sure helped- Shanna
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