Paylean, ever heard of this?

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L

Lost Creek

Joined
Feb 25, 2011
Messages
81
Location
United States
Has anyone ever heard of or used Paylean? Someone told me that this mixed in the feed ration helps with antler growth. Just want to get some opinions on this to see if it really works or if it would compromise the health of my bucks.
 
I don't know about that but I found something called selenium-90. Its 31% calcium and .02% selenium. Is this good for horn growth? It say for swine poultry and ruminant feeds.
 
richie0033 said:
I don't know about that but I found something called selenium-90. Its 31% calcium and .02% selenium. Is this good for horn growth? It say for swine poultry and ruminant feeds.
Click to expand...



where would i get it ???????:)
 
Paylean is a hog feed which puts on weight in hogs I was told. It is also used to help antler growth in deer. This is all told to me by someone from back east where some are using these products for antler growth. I would think all these products would be at a local hog and cattle feed store. I have no experience if this works but as they are just feeds and if they would work I would use it if it made good antler growth without any side effects like shorter life span.
 
I'm certainly not trying to ruffle any feathers here, but in my humble opinion the best remedy for antler growth is breeding with line-bred deer for the look that you want to achieve. Then take the time to study and match that up with your does to increase your odds of creating the type of animal that you desire.

I'm sorry, but breeding "name" A with "name" B because they are both "popular" is NOT a recipe for success. Take some time to study genetics in general and pass down traits in whitetails. Then do some more homework and try to weed out all of the negative traits... these are the basics of "breeding". I'm not an expert by any means, and I don't claim to be, but there's a lot to be gained from doing your homework when it comes to breeding deer.

Our feed mix couldn't be any more generic or simple. We don't feed anything that isn't 100% natural. Feed additives/supplements may get you some extra "funky" inches of antler growth, but if you really want to grow huge deer the answer is simple... GENETICS!

Just my 0.2 cents.
 
Michael you are so right and i am no expert at anything that is for sure but for any of you guys thinking about feeding extra selenium be very careful as i have heard of local farmer feeding it to holstien dairy cattle at 1000 pounds apeice and he killed 5 of them when the feed mix got to much selenium.Most feeds have enough of it already put in the pellets that you would need for deer.Gain would not be worth the risk(your deer) in my way of thinking.Breed them well and feed them well and you will grow inches..
 
Selenium and copper are all natural things in the feed. But when you use too much of these products they become poison to the animal and will kill the animal. Our deer copper requirements are fine for deer but would kill sheep over time as they will not be able to use as much as deer do.



Like most have said genetics and good feed will make the best deer over time. There really is no magic feed but when full feed requirements are met in our feed ration our deer will be at their best antler and body development.



At this point anyone who feels they have the best feed mix please post it up for all of us to see so we all can feed our deer the best foods.
 
Jack that would be a great thing if we could all get something like that.I know they say in some areas there is a selenium defiency in the ground.Alot of people say thats why some states cant grow bigger bucks in the wild like states of ohio,illinois.I think its true to some extent that someone could add something to the feed to make up for something else but i would'nt take the chance.Like michael says breed smart and feed good natural feed and minerals to keep them in tip top shape.
 
Another thing that may or may not be overlooked by some farmers/breeders is feeding the best quality alfalfa on a regular basis. Most of our pens are 80% woods, so we don't have much forage for the deer. For this reason, we feed western cut alfalfa pretty much year round. We didn't do this our first year and after we started feeding good alfalfa on a regular basis the body condition of our deer increased tremendously! Sometimes it's a culmination of the little things that can make all the difference as opposed to looking for some magic trick to grow big deer.
 
I think if you will look in to Paylean or Show Tec or Optiflexx, you will find all of these feeds have Paylean in them. We have used these products in our cattle for years. Paylean is a Beta Antagonist and should only be used for the last 20 to 40 days when finishing out Feeder calves. It also states that feeding to breeding animals or Bulls is not recommended. I would also advise to read your label. This is a restricted use chemical. You are required by law to use a Suit and Mask when handling this stuff. The concentration of this stuff is crazy. It only take around 4.5 to 9.0 g/per ton of feed. That is miniscule. It can cause lung damage and blindness when not handled right. Just want to make sure everyone knows the hazards here. I know we use a lot of things off label in the Deer business. Just be careful. I also heard from a very reputable vet that the FDA has an ongoing investigation in to an area of the US, that has seen a major spike in the use of Paylean, that is not Hog and cattle related? May want to be real careful if you live in that area and are feeding off label?
 
Mike, I was down with A few farmers over the weekend that had some pens with grass and some with all gravel. I asked them if they notice a difference in there bucks from one pen to another. They dont feed hay, because they want the deer to eat their food. And they said that their bucks in the gravel pen with no forage, are bigger every year. They also said that a group of guys from florida came up last summer and toured many farms in PA and found that all buck pens with gravel had bigger racks and bigger bodies.

My pens are woods also, and was thinking of adding on in our grassy field, but now im not sure. What is your opinion on this?
 
I've never heard of that before, but that doesn't mean there isn't some truth to it even if it's just a coincidence. Maybe they are getting something from the gravel if it's limestone??? I really don't know. I can tell you that I will not change my alfalfa feeding. Still much better body condition here at my place with feeding it versus not feeding it.

Sorry if that doesn't directly answer your question... it's interesting though.



Thanks,



Mike
 
just a thought, can't remember where I heard it but, some farmer said he did not want his bucks eating anything but the feed he gave them. No forage, no clover, no grass, just fresh water and the feed mix. Gravel pens would have no forage so the buck would be forced to eat just the mix, maybe at increased amounts to make up the difference, thus bigger bodies, larger racks?
 
Mike, we were wondering if maybe there was no chance for bacteria and worms to live on rock. In grass, they have a place to get out of the sun. IDK

We have also fed alfalfa this winter with great success! Its something im going to start watching though.
 
Yes, thats what these guys were wanting. The food has everything the deer needs. The more grass they eat, the less good food they eat
 
The key ingreedient in paylean is ractopamine hydrochloride. It is a dangerous suppliment to mess with. I don't believe you can have your mill mix it in your ration because it is toxic to horses. It can cause severe hoof and feet problems. It cannot be used with any other type of medicated minerals. You must also feed at least 16% protein with it.



Here is a warning label from the manufacture.



Ractopamine may increase the number of injured and/or fatigued pigs during marketing.



Not for use in breeding swine.



Not For Human Use:

Warning

The active ingredient in Paylean, ractopamine hydrochloride, is a beta-adrenergic agonist. Individuals with cardiovascular disease should exercise special caution to avoid exposure. Not for use in humans. Keep out of the reach of children. The Paylean 9 formulation (Type A Medicated Article) poses a low dust potential under usual conditions of handling and mixing. When mixing and handling Paylean, use protective clothing, impervious gloves, protective eye wear, and a NIOSH-approved dust mask. Operators should wash thoroughly with soap and water after handling. If accidental eye contact occurs, immediately rinse eyes thoroughly with water. If irritation persists, seek medical attention.



I don't know about you guys but that's a little much for me.
 
WillPenn Whitetails said:
I'm certainly not trying to ruffle any feathers here, but in my humble opinion the best remedy for antler growth is breeding with line-bred deer for the look that you want to achieve. Then take the time to study and match that up with your does to increase your odds of creating the type of animal that you desire.

I'm sorry, but breeding "name" A with "name" B because they are both "popular" is NOT a recipe for success. Take some time to study genetics in general and pass down traits in whitetails. Then do some more homework and try to weed out all of the negative traits... these are the basics of "breeding". I'm not an expert by any means, and I don't claim to be, but there's a lot to be gained from doing your homework when it comes to breeding deer.

Our feed mix couldn't be any more generic or simple. We don't feed anything that isn't 100% natural. Feed additives/supplements may get you some extra "funky" inches of antler growth, but if you really want to grow huge deer the answer is simple... GENETICS!

Just my 0.2 cents.
Click to expand...



I think you down playing the importance of good feed. Line breeding wont make your current bucks perform better. Good feed will get the most out of them. Better breeding will improve your herd but so will feed. On our farm we talk about 3 main keys to better bulls. Genetics, feed, and stress. All are very important.
 
steve w said:
I think you down playing the importance of good feed. Line breeding wont make your current bucks perform better. Good feed will get the most out of them. Better breeding will improve your herd but so will feed. On our farm we talk about 3 main keys to better bulls. Genetics, feed, and stress. All are very important.
Click to expand...



Hi Steve,

I'm not trying to down play good nutrition by any means. The point I was making is that feed will only take them so far. The original question was about a supplement, and that's mostly where my comments were aimed. Instead of trying to find the next magic bullet that artificially enhances antler growth, my point is that you should work harder on the breeding end.



I understand that there are several key factors that are critical to a healthy herd as well as antler development. Miss any one of those and you will not get the most out of your animals. We take nutrition, stress levels, and genetics all very seriously.

You and I actually agree on the key factors.
 
I have one question. Why do so many "BIG" bucks leave a farm and fed the "same feed" lose antler size and never gain it back, even 2 and 3 years down the road? That alway's makes me think that they were given some "secret" product to inhance their antlers!
 

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