The Truth About Stickers, Redoy Ben and Ratchet

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Joined
Aug 24, 2010
Messages
123
Location
New Stanton PA
As everyone knows, there are always two sides to every story. Often, it can be difficult to determine which is the closest to the truth. Unfortunately, the more popular one wins everyone’s attention whether or not it is the truth. The necessary research is not performed before the story gets passed along to the next person and is accepted as truth once more. The further the story gets passed on, the further from the truth it becomes, and the facts are misconstrued and lost in the process.

The point I am trying to make is if this business is going to be successful, we all need to start working together and being more competent and reliable. We need to be careful and do some background research on information we receive and its resource and not assume everything we hear is in fact the truth. We all know what happens when we assume…

Without taking the approach to work together, this business is going to fall apart quickly. It has already made a turn for the worse, and anyone who does not notice this is living under a rock.

Now would be a good time to take a moment to introduce myself. My name is Michael Goodman, and I was born into this business. As many of you know, my dad is Mick Goodman, and he has been raising deer for over twenty-seven years. He was actually one of the first people to start raising deer when he started Goodman’s Whitetail Haven. My younger brother Andy has been involved with the deer all of his life as well.

Being around deer all my life, I have seen what has gone on and changed throughout the years. The one issue that has bothered me the most is seeing pedigrees of animals that are not truthful, complete, based on fact, or it could be a total lie. The reason for the faulty information stems back to assuming the truth instead of taking the time to get the correct information. Credit needs to be given where credit is due. There is a reason these deer exist, and it is because of their ancestors which were propagated by the founders of this business. If not for them, who is to say raising deer could be something we would have the choice to do today, or that such leaps and bounds of progress could have been achieved in this industry?

This is why it is so important for people to be responsible when they share information and ensure it is true. More respect should be given to those who started this industry and have made it a reality.

My feelings are based on an actual example I have experienced during my time in the deer industry. Years ago when we started raising deer, it was harder, and it took a lot longer to build up a herd. You could not just go out and buy deer anywhere to get started right away. There were only a handful of people in Pennsylvania at the time that raised deer. Sure, we bought deer, but most were acquired through the Pennsylvania Game Commission. They would bring an orphaned fawn or a fawn that was ignorantly taken in by someone who thought it had been abandoned by its mother. These fawns were brought to us to save them and give them a chance. This is unheard of today. The Game Commission takes these fawns into their own hands now and decides their fate.

These fawns are where we got most of our deer, and we bred these deer to produce a larger herd. We were able to produce a lot of respectable deer in this manner. We realized over the years we had a particular doe that produced nice bucks no matter what she was bred with. This doe was named Sugar, and she was one of the fawns we received through the Game Commission. She was found by a high school student who was keeping her in his car in Greene County. She was in fact from the wild of Pennsylvania. We took great care of her and she was one of our breeders. Sugar was one of the best producing does we ever had. As she was raised and cared for by us, she is one of the Goodman Foundation does.

There is a reason I just explained the origin of Sugar. One year we bred her to the buck we felt was the best choice. As a result, she had twin buck fawns in the spring much to our surprise. We kept these two bucks until they got their first racks. That fall, Andy Foor came to buy some deer from us, and became interested in the two bucks. My dad offered to sell him one of the twin yearlings that was a 9 point. We had decided to keep the other one who was a ten point and had split G2s. Andy Foor took my dad up on his offer and took the buck he would name Ratchet home that day.

Ratchet has produced a lot of big deer for Andy Foor, and for Mark Price who used Ratchet as a breeder. From Ratchet was spawned Liberty, Freedom, and many other well known bucks. We kept the other twin for another year and he produced another respectable rack. Once it was time to sell more deer in the fall, we received interest from Roy Yoder. Roy and his acquaintances came to get the deer they were interested in. During this visit, Roy became interested in the twin we kept, and purchased him.

Once Roy got the deer home, he allowed his brother-in-law Ben Coblentz to use the twin as a breeder buck. This is how the deer got the name Redoy Ben (Yoder spelled backwards and Ben). Anyone who has done their research will find that Redoy Ben produced Stickers of Texas. Stickers produced a buck known today as Texas Tea. There are countless other big bucks that have been produced from Redoy Ben and his offspring. Redoy Ben and Ratchet are some of the best producers in the business today, and will continue to be in the future.

This is by far one of the best bloodlines in the business and most reliable producers of big bucks. Who would have thought this bloodline came from a doe from the wild of Greene County Pennsylvania and adopted into the Foundation Herd of Goodman’s Whitetail Haven founded by Mick Goodman? Sugar produced two of the greatest producing bucks in the industry.

Why do I need to tell you this anyway, you should know. You did your research, right?



Michael John Goodman



References: Mick Goodman, Andy Foor, Dave Creegan
 
all i can say is mickey has some quality animals and was one of the first to produce a 200 inch whitetail all from his own genetics the ratchet line seems to be very underated or mickey just doesnt get the credit he deserves i have 2 does linebred with mickeys genetics and had 2 real nice yearlings out of them last year im sure if you look hard enough his pedigrees show up some where in a leg of your pedigree wether it be from sickers redoy ben texas tea freedom liberty these deer are all from either ratchet or redoy ben mick if your reading hopefully youll get some recognition back once again was that a bucky doe or that game comission greene county doe lol
 
Michael, Congrats to your family, they have done a great service to the industry. I have owned Redoy Weatherby for serveral years, he is a son of Redoy Ben. He was 240 inches at 4 years and was very clean and well balanced, hard to find today. He was born in 1999 and to this day I have a hard time finding a buck I like as well as him. If you can make another one like him let me know. I have heard a lot of good comments of the Goodman name from the older breeders. Gary Olson
 
Thanks for sharing that great information. I love to hear where some of our most famous animals got their start. I love to listen to Dean Ziegler tell about his early animals, how they got their names and who they went to. Reminds me of the Oscar/Prince line.



Sandy Malone

Prime Whitetails

Rush, NY
 
Wild Obsession Whitetails: that was a Goodman Buck and a Greene County Game Commission doe we called Sugar that produced the buck called Redoy Ben that we sold to Roy Yoder.
 
Barry,

As soon as we go back through our records, we will post the pedigree of Uno.

Thanks.

Michael
 
Sandy,

I just tried to purchase the straw of Weatherby Jr. from WT Exchange. Just another example of the kind of bucks being produced from the Ratchet / Redoy Ben / Goodman Foundation line along with the Oscar / Prince line. Hopefully there will be another straw of Weatherby Jr for auction in the near future. I would love to put this in one of my foundation does to see what it produces.
 
Sandy, I agree with you. I too based my small operation on Oscar/Prince background and was thinking the same as you when I read this. Michael Goodman, thank you for taking the time to show us some more of our "roots" and I hope more in this industry recognize some of the consistent producers of the past...and present. Gary Olson, I also am a big fan of weatherby, to this day his past big typical frame stands out and I hear good things about his offspring. Great post.
 
If you have ever been out to Ben Coblentz's farm you will see that he is still using that same Redoy Ben line. He has some of the best big clean deer I have seen on a farm. The most upsetting part is he lost his CWD status (over paperwork issues) and is sending his deer to the preserve so he can regain his status and start over. If you have anything from these lines they are keepers!

I have a few does that come from Redoy Ben II who I believe is a womb Brother to Weatherby, Or at least a full brother. They have been very consistent with good mass, and 6x frames.



Great line of Deer! Thanks for the history lesson Michael.
 
gwhaven..check Whitetail Exchange there is another straw of Weatherby Jr. available. If you don't win one in the auction, I'm sure we can set you up. I'm not familiar with Redoy Ben II but I do know that Weatherby is out of Redoy Ben and a Redoy Bill doe.



Sandy Malone

Prime Whitetails

Rush, NY
 
well said micky its all i have here for my bloodlines and i bread with a 165inch yearling and am happy with how the have grown thanks agine to micky goodman and dave creegan for all there had work
 
Just another example of predictability from a certain line. If you do your homework in advance and plan your herd more around constant production from a line and achieving your goals........GOOD THINGS WILL HAPPEN!!!!
 
I would also like to see the "Uno" pedigree....I just started my farm and bought my first 4 deer from Iowa. 1 buck yearling, and 3 bred does. One of the bred does (T813) is also my bucks Dam. The anchor doe in her pedigree is 14 Peggy Sue bred by "Uno"......
 
On the buck side would be Goodman Foundation. On the doe side would be Grazetti Line. Uno was sold to Barry McGrew over a decade ago. In those days, bloodlines weren't as closely watched as they are today. Both the Goodman Foundation and the Grazetti Line was 100% crossing of deer that were acquired from the PA Game Commission. With years of breeding these Game Commission animals, Uno was the start of better kept records of pedigrees in our herd. Since then, we have brought back into our herd Uno and Ratchet blood from other breeders previously sold to so that we're not breeding quite so tight. As one of the original deer breeders in PA (est.1984) we're not afraid to say where our herd initially came from. And if people would research Uno, Ratchet, Redoy Ben, and Goodman Foundation, they will find this blood line has done very well in this industry. We will be attending the PA Deerfarmers Association Meeting on April 9th. Looking forward to talking to some old friends and meeting some new.

Thanks.

Mick

Goodman's Whitetail Haven
 
This was the first time I read this post. After reading this post I think your dads farm was one of the first farms I ever visited. You and your brother were pretty young and your dad had you guys doing chores feeding the deer. If I remember right the buck you called uno was full body mounted in your house and your dad was making chandaleirs in the basement. This is a really good post never knew Redoy Ben came from your farm as well untill reading this. So this means Texas Tea does not have Bucky on the top of his pedigree but another PA buck. This just shows Texas Tea has some really different blood than the industry is used to.
 
Well I'm proud to say that we own a doe that is goodman stock top and bottom and she is the best for on my farm she has produced 5 bucks so far 1 yearling called anticipation that died on us another yearling that kept breaking off right in front of his g2 and still managed to put 15 points on his head a 2 year old we call monsoon who scored 222 with a 193" 6x8 frame with 29" of non typical and hopefully her buck fawn will be a nice yearling as well and mickey had a son out of her named country out of her that scored 220 with a 5x5 frame thanks for always sharing ur knowledge with me and helping out with questions on how to breed my does from u and I can't forget that live breeding to justice hope to have the same results out of those justice girls which I'm sure I will after breeding them back to a very wide buck with multiple points and once again ur genetics r in the bottom leg of that buck though Elijah from Barkley Young I'm sure u guys could ask Barkley what mucks genetics have done for him
 
Sorry for digging up an older thread but, for me it was a great read! I know people are still using some of the Redoy Ben lines but, we use it heavily in one particular group I have down here in TX. I have been looking for some outcrosses for my does and also looking for some newer "name brands" to help make our deer more marketable.



Up to this point we have only cared about production for our ranches but, we are to a point where we are going to actively enter the breeding market. This is just one group of deer we are using and it is fairly unique considering our location. It is great to have a true northern deer that came from the days when borders were open!



I also thought you guys might be interested in looking at a couple of pedigrees and a couple of 2yr olds we produced out of Redoy Ben without ever having to go "brand name" shopping. Redoy Ben is a fram producing machine and we have been very happy with our results.



I would also love to hear from some of your guys using or from those that have crossed Redoy Ben. I am always open to ideas. I think I am going to use some Texas Tea on some of my girls for sure but, I am not sure on the rest of them yet. My doe pedigrees all look very similar to those you see for these bucks mothers and grandmothers.



This first buck has Ben 6 times in his pedigree! You might have to blow the pdf up to see it all though. He was somewhere around 270@2 and growing his 3rd set now!



Buck 916



916Front.jpg




916Back.jpg






Here is buck 931, 304@2 and growing his 2nd set now as well. He only has Ben twice on the bottom which is why we are looking to start outcrossing our does. I think our does are wound so tight we might really be able to have some incredible bucks out of them with the right crosses!



931Front.jpg




931back.jpg




931Side.jpg
 

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