We have tranquilized and moved several hundred whitetail maybe even a thousand in the last 30 plus years with rompum and in recent years Telazol mix. Finally all the BAM hype got us . I ordered. a kit last week to move some bucks out of northern MN to our place. Antlers are off , outside temp around mid 20s, 3-5 year old bucks that are relatively calm . Five darts later into the hams of 4 different bucks , normal amount of visible bleeding from the dart , 2cc pneu darts same as we always use. Absolutely no reaction from any of the bucks. Is there such a thing as a bad batch of BAM. Anyone want a deal on unopened reverser for BAM? We waited a few hours and did 2cc Xylazine Telazol darts into the bucks we were hauling and the trailer was loaded. I am not trying to start the battle that is already documented on this forum of BAM vs? ..just stating this expensive experience and wondering if anyone has ever had a bad batch? I will be calling Zoopharm on Monday. I wonder if they sent us the placebo ?
BAM first experience
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Joined Aug 2012
303 Posts | 0+
Billings, MO
I would give them a call for sure. Please let us know what you find out. I love BAM, but have had nothing but excellent luck with it. Keep us posted.
Joined Sep 2010
572 Posts | 0+
Indiana
Joined Oct 2009
3,165 Posts | 1+
upstate ny
Arrowed11015701426980483
We have tranquilized and moved several hundred whitetail maybe even a thousand in the last 30 plus years with rompum and in recent years Telazol mix. Finally all the BAM hype got us . I ordered. a kit last week to move some bucks out of northern MN to our place. Antlers are off , outside temp around mid 20s, 3-5 year old bucks that are relatively calm . Five darts later into the hams of 4 different bucks , normal amount of visible bleeding from the dart , 2cc pneu darts same as we always use. Absolutely no reaction from any of the bucks. Is there such a thing as a bad batch of BAM. Anyone want a deal on unopened reverser for BAM? We waited a few hours and did 2cc Xylazine Telazol darts into the bucks we were hauling and the trailer was loaded. I am not trying to start the battle that is already documented on this forum of BAM vs? ..just stating this expensive experience and wondering if anyone has ever had a bad batch? I will be calling Zoopharm on Monday. I wonder if they sent us the placebo ?
LOL..Back to the old saying. If it aint broke, dont fix it. Hope you get it figured out. We will stick to the old ways here.
We have tranquilized and moved several hundred whitetail maybe even a thousand in the last 30 plus years with rompum and in recent years Telazol mix. Finally all the BAM hype got us . I ordered. a kit last week to move some bucks out of northern MN to our place. Antlers are off , outside temp around mid 20s, 3-5 year old bucks that are relatively calm . Five darts later into the hams of 4 different bucks , normal amount of visible bleeding from the dart , 2cc pneu darts same as we always use. Absolutely no reaction from any of the bucks. Is there such a thing as a bad batch of BAM. Anyone want a deal on unopened reverser for BAM? We waited a few hours and did 2cc Xylazine Telazol darts into the bucks we were hauling and the trailer was loaded. I am not trying to start the battle that is already documented on this forum of BAM vs? ..just stating this expensive experience and wondering if anyone has ever had a bad batch? I will be calling Zoopharm on Monday. I wonder if they sent us the placebo ?
LOL..Back to the old saying. If it aint broke, dont fix it. Hope you get it figured out. We will stick to the old ways here.
Joined Apr 2009
1,136 Posts | 0+
Bedford, PA
Sorry about your experience. That really sux. I've darted a couple hundred with Bam now and never had a problem. I'll take the bottles of reverser.
Joined Oct 2011
359 Posts | 0+
Columbia City, IN
Check your darts......i had a batch of darts that did not "fire".....the primers actually pushed out instead of firing.
I've done probably a hundred sedations with BAM and never had a problem. I cannot imagine five darts with NO reaction.
I've darted over two hundred deer with BAM and never had a problem. Can not say that with tel/xyl. I would send it back and have them check it out.
Joined Feb 2013
780 Posts | 1+
Markleville IN
definitely would be thinking that the problem could have been the darts. I would check that first. Too short of dart needle would create slow absorption. I have had that happen if I used a 1/2" dart with winter hair or it hit them high and went sub Q. It may take them 20 min or more to go out when that happens.
I know there were some issues last fall with them. If you purchased them last fall that might be the problem.
I know there were some issues last fall with them. If you purchased them last fall that might be the problem.
Joined Jul 2009
1,215 Posts | 0+
Deer Park, Alabama
Joined Apr 2009
1,136 Posts | 0+
Bedford, PA
Jerille brings up a good point. Just talking from lots of experience here... the only time I would ever use a 1/2" needle on a deer would be for fawns or small does in the summer. We use 1" needle on our bucks in winter and 3/4" on them in summer. The adult does all get 3/4" needles in winter and most of them get the same in summer. If they are smaller we may use 1/2" needle on them. After switching to this regimen years ago, we have dramatically reduced any issues with deer not going down quickly. I think this is often times one of the most overlooked aspects of chemical sedation/capture. If you're not getting the medicine into the muscle, you're going to have issues.
Joined Feb 2013
780 Posts | 1+
Markleville IN
I usually use 3/4 inch darts on adults year round and might use halves in the summer on adults and always on fawns. I have seen other people use a few 1" ers and lodge them into bone. My first experience doing testing for someone else , they were told to dart in the neck/shoulder and he hit the humerus with a dart using a pump. The shot fell off more than he anticipated. It broke the humerus lenth ways with the bone instead of across and had a very sharp point like a knife that was ready to come thru the skin and he opted to put her down. I always hit them in the rump after that experience. I think the less trauma with the dart the better thats why I use a 3/4".
We use all 1" needles tri port pneu darts on adult deer. 3/4" on young deer. The darts we used to finish the job were from 2 open packages that we tried with the BAM and they worked fine with xylazine/Telazol mix so I am confident the dart was not the problem. I had 1cc of BAM left in the bottle. Put it in a syringe today and injected into the hind end muscle tissue of a 90 lb doe fawn and there was no effect. She never faltered . My mistake might be that I don't have a sample to send back to Zoopharm. I know that it can work great as we have hauled and helped on other peoples deer that have used BAM. I think I will stay with the old school in the future but am anxious to talk to Zoopharm tomorrow.
Joined Feb 2013
780 Posts | 1+
Markleville IN
With that result sounds like there was definitely a problem with the bam. Send them the bottle there is probably enough residue for them to test. They can put some saline in with it and what little is left would mix. Better yet they should just replace it.
Joined Apr 2009
1,428 Posts | 0+
Northeast Wisconsin
We switched to BAM this year and haven't had any problems. Love how the deer reverse so quickly with no residual signs of being tranquilized.
Joined Apr 2009
1,136 Posts | 0+
Bedford, PA
I spoke with Steve at Wildlife Pharmaceuticals and learned a lot about BAM that will make my next experience much more favorable. The BAM kit arrived only a couple days before we needed it . Temperatures were below zero however the kit came out of a FedEx truck and went into the house. During the 3 hour drive north the BAM may have seen near freezing temps and likely saw freezing temps for a short period of time prior to loading the darts. When we loaded the darts the BAM solution was liquid.
In laymen's terms I believe I understand that cold at anytime near or below freezing will allow the 3 part BAM to "fall out of solution" rendering the BAM ineffective. My warm northern heart wasn't enough to bring it back to good function with the darts in my shirt pocket. I would have needed a hair dryer or the like to re--establish a functional mix .
I will further commend Wildlife Pharmaceuticals for contacting me after seeing this post. Steve was a ton of help and it all makes sense. Operator Error. Keep your BAM at above freezing at all times , load your darts at room temp , keep your darts warm until you are ready to shoot , our loaded darts in the gun may have seen freezing for 15-20 minutes allowing the BAM to separate in the dart . If there is any reason to think your BAM has been exposed to freezing temps give it a warm up.
In laymen's terms I believe I understand that cold at anytime near or below freezing will allow the 3 part BAM to "fall out of solution" rendering the BAM ineffective. My warm northern heart wasn't enough to bring it back to good function with the darts in my shirt pocket. I would have needed a hair dryer or the like to re--establish a functional mix .
I will further commend Wildlife Pharmaceuticals for contacting me after seeing this post. Steve was a ton of help and it all makes sense. Operator Error. Keep your BAM at above freezing at all times , load your darts at room temp , keep your darts warm until you are ready to shoot , our loaded darts in the gun may have seen freezing for 15-20 minutes allowing the BAM to separate in the dart . If there is any reason to think your BAM has been exposed to freezing temps give it a warm up.
Joined Feb 2013
780 Posts | 1+
Markleville IN
Yes it will precipitate if it gets to cold. On a side note, lol, I forgot one in my pocket, washed it and dried it and it still worked FYI
Joined Oct 2009
3,165 Posts | 1+
upstate ny
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