DNA guarantee -Auctions

HC1957 · May 19, 2009

Looking for your opinions. Take a look at the auction lot # 23 and tell me what you think this means by DNA Guaranteed. Is this consignor guarantying the sire and dam or all animals in this pedigree chart. These days everyone wants DNA in their breeding stock to proven genetic lines and don't know how to evaluate these kinds of consignment lots. Tell me what you think.

http://www.texasdeerauction.net/TX2009/slides/23.html

ekljr · May 19, 2009

I think it explains itself sounds like your getting a fawn quaranteed from bambi 727 doe and maxbo

PaintedMeadowsBJs · May 19, 2009

I take it that....

The fawn will DNA to Vanquero... and if Y97 is on file...

But Redoy Bill Grandson is going back pretty good, but if on file???

Same with G32 and Clint... it's going back pretty far but...???

I am just starting to DNA this year, so I hope to learn stuff, but I know nothing yet...

I am going to dive in head first once these Timberghost,Maxbo Extreme,Maxbo XL,ect...Fawns hit the ground I will be doing at least 20 tests

IndependenceRanch · May 20, 2009

HC1957, the phrase "DNA guaranteed" seems to have different meanings to everyone. That is a good question to ask the seller.

Some people are afraid to call sellers ahead of time and ask questions thinking they are showing their cards. At auction I have been the buyer many times, and a few months ago I was a seller. I think it is a good idea to call and ask questions of the seller, but don't talk about what you think something will sell for. Any other questions about DNA, any sons produced, what might the seller be willing to do extra as far as time keeping the animals for you and such are all good questions to ask ahead of time.

Droptine · May 20, 2009

IndependenceRanch said:
HC1957, the phrase "DNA guaranteed" seems to have different meanings to everyone. That is a good question to ask the seller.

Some people are afraid to call sellers ahead of time and ask questions thinking they are showing their cards. At auction I have been the buyer many times, and a few months ago I was a seller. I think it is a good idea to call and ask questions of the seller, but don't talk about what you think something will sell for. Any other questions about DNA, any sons produced, what might the seller be willing to do extra as far as time keeping the animals for you and such are all good questions to ask ahead of time.

That's good advice.

I take the words "DNA Guaranteed" to only mean it will DNA back to the sire and dam that are listed in the pedigree. Everything after that is up to you to confirm. The first thing I do is look up the sire and dam in DNA registry and see how far back they are registered. Usually if they are registered you can find them because you can search by animal name, owner and farm name, so with a little effort you can usually find them. If I can't and I really like the animal I'll call the person to ask if the sire and dam are registered. If say the sire is registered and dam is not I'll take that into account during the auction. You also have to take into account the person's reputation selling the deer. To be a smart buyer at an auction you have to do your homework before hand and you'll usually come out on the winning end.

Ultimately, a guarantee is only worth as much as the person making the guarantee.

Reed68 · May 20, 2009

"DNA" is a piece of paper. Is he or she a producer? If so, good deer. I have seen some long DNA'ed animals be harvested as "managment" deer. DNA only boost the price of an animal until they can prove themselves.

Alex · May 20, 2009

My two cents is DNA to mother and father great if got more, but the fawn will only go back one level of verification.

Reed68 you are right on! with both counts!

IndependenceRanch · May 20, 2009

DNA is proof of parentage, nothing more. But without the proof I won't buy.

Don't confuse DNA with quality genetics.

lonestar2409 · May 20, 2009

My 2 cents is the DNA should go back to the father and mother and if the grandsire and granddam are on profile they should DNA back to them if they are also listed on pedigree chart thats why people want the DNA animals

HC1957 · May 21, 2009

Roger, I agree if seller is selling quality genetics like Redoy Bill the buyer wants DNA to prove that Vaquero is out of that bloodline. That is why DNA is so important to prove the proven genetics is there and not just take the buyers word for it.

HC1957 · May 21, 2009

Steve, I dont understand. How did you determine that only DNA the dam and sire were guarateed? It did not say that in the description and the buyer should not have to read between the lines. I take it that if he says DNA guarateed , then all animals listed in is advertisement should DNA or leave it blank.

stevel · May 21, 2009

Don't know about everyone else, but we guarantee DNA to the parents only. If we have further generations on file, we supply that too, or the purchaser can get that info from Wildlife Genetics. Most of our premier does were purchased from other farms and most are only DNA'd to the sire, not the dam.

HC1957 · May 21, 2009

Stevel, Remember my original question is the lot listed in the auction, Does the way that this lot is listed and the wording DNA guaranteed only mean to the sire and dam or to all listed animals in the pedigree chart? How do you read this lot description? Example, If I was buying a 2009 fawn out of a big Maxbo son, would I want the Maxbo son to DNA to Maxbo?

WillPenn Whitetails · May 21, 2009

The way that I take DNA guarantee is that it will be guaranteed to DNA back to the sire at a minimum and most times the listed dam as well. To answer your second question... YES, you would absolutely want the Maxbo son to DNA back to Maxbo.

When I sell an animal I guarantee that the fawns will DNA back to the SIRE and DAM that I say they are out of. If the sire and dam have been dna'd farther up the line then that's great.

If I were you I would simply pick up the phone and speak with the consigner... it's a very common practice and something that I do when looking to purchase an animal from another farm.

Even if it's a friend you still need to know all of the details to avoid any confusion or hard feelings.

Good luck.

HC1957 · May 21, 2009

Consider this. What if you bought a straw of semen from a yearling buck that was advertised as auction lot in a published catalog as a Maxbo son and DNA is guaranteed. The consignor said the DNA sample was being processed and when the sample came back the yearling buck did not DNA to Maxbo. Would you now say that the consignor was guarantying the DNA of the yearling buck to Maxbo or not ?

WillPenn Whitetails · May 21, 2009

HC1957 said:
Consider this. What if you bought a straw of semen from a yearling buck that was advertised as auction lot in a published catalog as a Maxbo son and DNA is guaranteed. The consignor said the DNA sample was being processed and when the sample came back the yearling buck did not DNA to Maxbo. Would you now say that the consignor was guarantying the DNA of the yearling buck to Maxbo or not ?

I think of a guarantee in the simplest of terms. If the buck was guaranteed to DNA to a certain deer and then it didn't, the guarantee is there to protect the buyer. If it doesn't DNA to what you say it does then the buyer should receive100% of their money back.

The consigner and buyer are both responsible for being clear on the terms of said guarantee BEFORE the animal is purchased. I like to keep it simple, but also offer options as long as the buyer has a strong interest in the options that are provided. The option needs to be at least as good as the original AND the buyer should be happy with the option provided. If not you go to plan B by offering 100% refund... again it should be clear to all parties involved.

You can put a guarantee on anything you want... it's how you back up that guarantee that's important.

Alex · May 21, 2009

In your example I would say he stated DNA to Maxbo, beign Maxbo son. This thread is bringing in good questions for future sales. Keep it up. Trouble is auctions will be twice as long as they are now which are to long. Now ask these questions each time.

Maybe we need a star or designation by each animal that has DNA, or italized some designation that indicates DNA on file.

It makes no sence to me just doing the sire versus both. Except monies to get extra samples. In some cases I'm building the does versus the bucks. I want to know verification on the does.

DNA guarantee -Auctions

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