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Giardia in deer

Joined Apr 2011
40 Posts | 0+
Kenosha, WI
We have had several reindeer calves born this year, seven in all, expecting around a few more.



As usual, we started several of them on the bottle. We usually leave the babies on their moms for about five days, then pull them. Reindeer have pretty weak immune systms for the first three months of life, so we really like to give them a good start on their dams.



The bottle fed calves are isolated from the rest of the deer and other exotics. In fact they are on a completely separate farm from the whitetail deer and fallow deer.



The bottle fed calves slowly started all to exhibit some very unusual symptoms. They were getting tremors, and going off the milk. They did not have a high or low temp, just normal 101.5. They did not start off with scours. They just started to lose control, looked neurological. They wanted the bottle, but could not control their movements, and would fall over and hit the ground.



Again, no fever, no wheezing, no scours. We had never seen anything like it. All of the bottle raised calves were exhibiting the same signs. By about day 4 or 5, they started to scour.



At this point we had already had the vet out several times, pulled blood for cbc, chem panel, and fecal sample for testing. We had them on draxin, a sulfa drug for the scours, had them on vitamin B-12 shots, and were running fluids I -V. Some of the deer started to show subtle signs of recovery. But two had already passed. So we sent them out to have necropsy reports.



The vets were not really sure what had happened, and with everything getting sent out, we had no immediate answer. They seemed to think some virus, toxin, or bacteria was the cause.



We had no choice but to change milk replacers just in case. Still nothing helped. We had a few of the calves on I V at the vet clinic every four hours.



All of our calves on the cows were uneffected.



Finally, the begining of the tests started to come back. The calves were coming up positive for giardia.



We have never seen anything like this, or were we prepared for it. We run regular fecal flotations at our vet's office, but they said that giardia can be hard to spot. They usually recommend sending it out to bigger labs with higher powered microscopes.



If we had not sent all of these tests out to the University of Minnesota, don't know that we would even have gotten anything back.



We were told that the giardia can spread via animal to animal, natural water ways, the soil, and fecal matter. The cows can literally lay down in cyst infested fecal matter, and the calves can pic it up from nursing on their mothers.



Has anyone out there successfully treated this on their deer herds, and if so, what has worked best?



Our reindeer are very handleable compared to our whitetail deer. We can give oral and injectable drugs rather easily.



Any advice?



Thanks,

Steve
 
Hi Steve,

Metronidazole at recommend dose will do the trick and can be put in the milk.
 
Thanks Jack! The secretary at the vet's office said something that sounded like that over the phone. But my vet was "off" for the day, so had not confirmed anything with him.



Have you treated the dams as well as the calves with this?
 
Steve - I had a buck last early fall that had symptoms that you describe. I first noticed he had separated, so I went looking for him, found him laying, and when he got up he had tremors and loss of balance. But after a few moments, he gathered himself, walked normally to the water and drank. Never had seen that before so I didn't know what to think. Wife had to do chores the next day, and told me the buck didn't show. Went the next day to knock him down and give him what I had for meds, and he was dead.

A week or so later, in the same pen, a buck began to show the same symptoms. Actually I'm not sure he could take a step he was so out of balance. He could get up, but that was about it, and I didn't push him. I darted him and gave him all I had, not knowing what he had.

Scott Heinrichs told me to give him Pen G. So I did, as well as other things I give when they are down. He recovered 100% and is healthy as all get out today.

Scott thought he might have had Listeria(sp), and maybe he did, but the symptoms were excactly how you have described.

Interesting to note for me, I have spent thousands of dollars(ie ecropsys) trying to find out why I had ''mysterious deaths'' now and then, and then the deaths actually escalated to the point of way too often.

Since you said that Giardia is hard to pick up, I'm wondering if that was my problem all along.

I know that I have had standing water in these pens where most of the deaths occured, so that would fit with the Giardia. Figured all along it had to do with the standing water.

What do you suppose transmitted the Giardia to your calves?
 
Mark-

You may have had listeriosis (also called circling disease)- the symptoms sound like the ones Steve is describing. The key to these stories for me is to try and remember the things it COULD be and the treatments for each, and then do multiple treatments all at once to cover my bases. You don't usually get a second chance with a whitetail, so your first attempt better include the right fix; at least that's the way I approach it.
 
Mark,



Yes, your description is very similar to what our calves were exhibiting. The University of Minnesota found the giardia in a fecal sample, the only answer we have recieved so far.



We too have water that enters our reindeer pens. It is not standing, but is spring fed. I am always cautious about the water, and our deer do not have access to it now, we have shut off that particular pen.



Given my circumstances, since these deer were only one week old bottle-feds, I am assuming they got it from their dams. The calves would not have been in the water, and after five days of age, they were not even anywhere near it.



The vet has told me the dams can carry it, and some may not exhibit signs, or lay in infested feces, the soil and water can transmit it to their calves or animal to animal.



Again, with the calves only on their moms for five days, then completely isolated, I can only think they were exposed to the giardia in the pen with water or from another animal.



Any other thoughts out there?



We are going to run some more fecal test on the mature deer and send out to the university, then plan on treating with Metronidazole (What Jack had suggested).

Steve
 
Giardia also known as beaver fever is from water infected with giardia. You Wisconsin guys had it in the Milwaukee drinking water some 8 years back I think. The does will lay in water infected with giardia so it can move between any animals in the herd. Feces in the water from infected animals will spread giardia quickly in the water. Could it be the water you are using to make your bottles has giardia in it. I would have that checked.

Our giardia problem was in our dogs who were drinking in standing water. We treated them with great results and drained the standing water areas. Problem solved as we have not had any giardia in animals for seven years. We did also add metronidazole to all deer drinking water that year.
 
Hi Jack,



We mix our milk replacer with red cap milk (instead of water). The red cap milk comes from the grocery store so it is pasturized.



So I am ruling that out, but definately think it is in the creek water, who knows the dogs could be involved too.



The fecal tests are not that expensive, for what they are worth. Planning on running several more from the herd and treating everyone...guess the dogs too.



Were you just dosing your deer in the water troughs? I think we could catch up all the reindeer and give the doses orally if that would work.



What do you think?



You sound pretty knowlegeable in this area, and I really appreciate your help.



Steve
 
Steve,

I think I would catch up all the reindeer and give them each the proper dose per their body weight.
 
This site is absolutely the best tool out there for finding out what things could be problems in our deer and experience in treating it. The vets often don't have any answers and rarely deal with deer anyways and if they do the outcome is usually not that great. Experience from other deer farmers is the key to finding out what could be wrong and how to treat it. Thanks to all the ones who post what they know and have experienced on here, every bit helps. I'll guarantee someone else who has these same early symptoms will come across this very post and no boubt will be able to save some animals because of it. Steve I hope for the best in your deers recovery, good luck to all this fawning season.



Cody Warne
 
Jack - I will get ahold of the Metronidazole and dose each deer accordingly.



Mark, thanks for describing the symptoms you saw with your buck, it was exactly what I was seeing in the reindeer calves.



Thanks Guys for the responses. You are right Cody, this forum, and its MEMBERS are a terrific help with everything.
 
I had a scare with Giardia about 10 years or so back in another state and residence of course but wanted to share my story.



Had a litter of lab pups out of one of my working labrador ******* in 2004 that had already sold every single pup other than pick of litter female. 3 of the pups had already been flown to thier new homes scattered across the US , 4 in the states mid flight & 1 heading to Canada mid flight when I got the call with the news.



The one female pup that was picked by that litters sire owner locally called in distress saying she hoped she wasnt too late but her pup had just tested positive to Giardia and asked if I had noticed any symptoms in the others bfore flight & that I would be needing to contact all ASAP to alert them of the possible threat and take thier pups in immediately to be treated.

I was in shock firstly because I didnt knw what the heck GIardia was, secondly, I hadnt a clue to know how the heck if at all, any of the puppies got this so called Giardia from our facility. Like this story, All puppies were isolated to a whelping facility since they hadnt had all required vaccinations until 8 weeks old couldnt risk having them exposed to anything harmful. WHat I didnt realize at the time was that I hadnt kept the ***** isolated to the whelping area with her pups! Here was the problem. I worked my older dogs daily on a small watering hole just behind my ex husbands families house in the country. Had been doing this for 7 some odd years without a thought otherwise! Coco was no exception to the daily exercise routine so she was allowed to come out from the whelping pen for about an hour evry day to swim! The small pond was in mid of a pasture with NO shade at all and to top it off had been one of the hottest summers at that time of the year!

Long story short, I contacted all puppy owners at which time stated thier pups were healthy as ever with no signs or parasites after being evaluated by vets. Being the person I am felt obligated to send everyone the advised dosage to treat thier pup with Metradolinzole just in case. That afternoon I was overnighting packets out but by the time It took the packets to make it to thier destinations Every single puppy was ill with a variety of symptoms! Scours with and without blood mixed, lethargic, dehydrated with no appetite etc... Luckily I was able to alert everyone to watch for anything out of the normal but had I not known when I did...would have lost all of thos puppies simply because it is so hard to diagnose without indepth testing which unless you instruct a local vet DOESNT test for the Giardia Bacteria in a routine check up and/ or Acclimation certificate of health which was a requirement to transport puppies via airplane.It is a silent killer untreated and 90% of the time gets misdiagnosed as being an illness such as coccidiosis and parvoinfluenza virus in canines.

The vet informed most all of the pups families that Giardia is a water based Bacteria that typically cant survive through the winter cold months thus for making it more obvious during the end of spring hotter weather months. Giardia is injested by transmission of fecal matter, is not contracted In vetro but can cause conjunctivitis if born ******lly, also is transmitted from one to another infant as a result of feeding off of thier mothers utter! If I recall correctly (please object in the event I am not correct) a mothers milk is not what is contagious it is the direct contact from the suckling in which the Giardia is transmitted to begin that cycle. I do know that there is a vaccination for the Giardia in canine form but is not usually one of the live viruses covered in a puppy 5, 7 or 8 way puppy vaccine. Frustrating as it has become to think you have all vaccines available in the prevention of cross contamination or potential viruses to find out after we lose 4 or better animals, Oh by the way theres one more thing that might kill your stock...lol! Hope this helped!
 

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