Texas Question

For breeders the TDA magazines are by far and away the largest. For Texas hunters and breeders both it would be Texas Trophy Hunters magazine. Texas Trophy Hunters magazine has become the magazine that every hunter in Texas reads.

Deer Breeders Co-0p have both Texas and Northern breeders so it wouldn't be bad either. Newer and smaller than TDA. Different views than TDA on issues in Texas- to put it in a politically correct way.

DD WHITETAILS you wanted a reason here it is .......CWD!!!!! What alot of outa state breeders dont realize is that If it were to be found in texas they would attempt to shut us down.We have tested many thousands of animals over the last 5yrs and have yet to have a confirmed case, the greatest chance we have of getting it, is through open boarders. Listen.. we are not afraid of open boarders hurting our native sales.Truth is pure northern animals would not sell that well in Texas,, Why you ask???? EHD!!!! I love some of the big northerns and have been using their semen for a while now with great results on my pure texas and 1/4 northern does but it is no secret(in texas) that death loss to ehd raises drastically in 3/4 northerns and beyond here.Think about it this way... cwd in texas means no more of us texans purchasing semen from the north or from anywere else for that matter..Real talk here...

Does anybody have contact information for TDA magazine and Texas Trophy Hunter? I would like to order those magazines.

tda 210-767-8300 tth 210-523-8500

Deer Boy I figured CWD was the case........we here in PA have no confirmed cases either, and we share then same risk as Texas should it ever be found here......but I do beleive if your going to get it it's coming through the WILD and not the cervid industry.......so unless you build a really BIG wall around your state you will never be out of the woods from getting it. I do understand the EHD end of it as far as the Northern deer not surviving it as much as your Southern deer do....lets just hope they find a vaccination for it where we won't have to worry about that anymore....thats pretty much all we can hope for there.

I am from Alabama and would have to strongly agree with deerboy. I have northern and southern deer and the northerns are hard to keep alive. My southerns have never been vaccinated and have not had any problems. The northerns got vaccinated and still almost died. Also it is not just ehd everything seems to jump on the northerns this far south. I love the looks of the northern but pure northerns are a maintenance issue here. Even with a vaccine if the goal is to raise stockers and shooters how would you vaccinate a deer that has been released? I personally prefer a 50/50 mix of northern and southern.

I have a question on immunities. Deer semen is being listed on the exchange as ehd resistant from pure texas strains. If immunities comes through the doe then what difference does it make which semen is used for ehd?

For me and what I see living in Iowa is if Texas had open borders then lots of shooter bucks from most all of the states would go to Texas and then people like me who have not made the leap to a certified herd status and try to sell all shooters in-state would have a better market and less competition when it comes to selling in the fall. We have just a few reserves in Iowa and the number of deer they buy is limited and I am sure I am competing with out of state deer when it comes to selling mine here. This is of course normal and and I can't kick on supply and demand , it makes the world go around , just that last year my small number of shooters (4) could not be sold because my buyer was shut off already on more bucks. I think the national industry was relying on Texas a lot for sales of live shooter bucks and without this market the fast backup on too much supply for the demand in the other states came faster than most saw coming. Texas is working hard to gear up to supply all of their own needs for their reserves and this makes us on the outside of Texas looking in think that there might not ever be a change in status and sales of live bucks to Texas might never return. The breeders in Texas have only each other as competition for sales and lots of opportunities to sell so I guess it makes me quite envious of the situation....the truth told , but then I get to live in the great state of Iowa....best of luck to all in the future whitetail business where ever you live. Jim

Deerboy, CWD you say? Are you a monitered herd? Most that I know in Texas are NOT... How can you use CWD for a reason when most if not all folks that would be selling into Texas are monitered. 5,6,7,10 years of monitering should be proof that you will not get CWD from a captive herd. Wild maybe. I believe that is wrong for any state to close it's borders. This is America after all. We all speak of our freedoms. WHat about the freedoms to buy, sell or give our deer to anyone we chose. I wish the state of Oklahoma would shut the border with Texas from any hoof stock from crossing. I'd bet the cattlemens association in Texas would be crying then. Also, you mention CWD, what about TB. There is confirmed cases of TB in cattle in Texas and also if my mind has not slipped wasn't there a case of mad cow in Texas?

The facts are the Texas guys want to keep it Texas and the best way to do so is through a BS statement of CWD. Also, if the northern deer die so easy then wouldn't most guys not buy them anyway? Real talk... come on it is just more of the same talk.

Although we are not Tracks or Texas Trophy Hunter, we are unique in content and your ad doesn't blend in with all the TX ads. Makes you "Unique" too! Deer Tracking Magazine (although a small family business) has a growing number of Texas subscribers. Also, we have sent out over 300 complimentary issues to Texas in the last 2 issues of Deer Tracking. That's 300 more people that saw your ads... for free!



In our travels last year, we were fortunate to meet up with longtime subscriber Jason Larue- we call him "lucky Larue" (cause he couldn't go on any farm tour without finding four leaf clovers!!) If all Texans are as friendly as Jason, they must come from good stock!



Many Texans have written to tell us that they like the content they see in the magazine and 1st time 3 yr subscriptions are common coming out of Texas. Thanks Texas for your support!



When we all work together within out limitations to change those limitations (even if it is slowly), it makes us all stronger being united. So it is good to focus on the areas where we are united- Big deer, great semen, and good people. United we stand, divided we will fall! (Canada, Texas and the rest of the States!) Seems to me that NADeFA is a great place to start -to unify ALL deer farmers!

I have a cool Idea. How about we take our infected northern bucks weighing in at around 350lbs and have a cage match with those 150lb Texas native deer winner takes all.

HEY ARROWHEAD First off this is deer forums not cattle forums and I am a deer breeder dont see what the hell tb in cattle and mad cow disease has todo with this thread. You saying we want to keep it texas means you think we are afraid open boarders will hurt our biz I STRESS ONCE AGAIN MOST OF US INCLUDING ME ARE NOT!!! We use northern semen in our texas born does and immmunities are passed through these texas born does to their babies which greatly increases a fawns chance of surviving it.You say if northern genetics die so easily than wouldnt most texans not buy them...EXACTLY ! Proving my point that we are not afraid northern deer would hurt our biz.But the fact is you nor anyone else can say what the stipulations will be on cwd monitering for people moving deer into texas if boarders were open. So would open boarders highten the risk of cwd in texas of course they would it is clearly BS on your part to say it wldnt.

Arrowhead,



CWD is not the only reason for border closure. Health issues in general have been a concern. The borders havent always been closed and well if you knew the actual breeders that brought in northern deer they would tell you they lost 3/4 of those deer. Could you afford to lose 3/4 of your herd? Here in Texas we deal with EHD year around and very high temperatures also. We have been getting better success with Northern semen and Texas Doe's and passing down of immunties to there offspring just like deerboy said. Why the complaining of border closure all of sudden?. Since the borders have been closed Semen prices have gone through the roof. In fact, Texas border closure has only helped the overall deer market industry and if you followed some of the top auctions you would see that Texas breeders have been a big part of those auctions like the TOP 30 and Nadefa just to name a few. Many Texas breeders have started deer farms up north and some northern breeders are starting deer herds in Texas too. So dont say that Texas wants to by itself.

Is this cage match gonna be in Texas in the summer time? Bc i would love to see a 100% northern (350 lb)deer in South Texas in the summer time it would be like you taking a piece of meat out of the freezer and watch it spoil and rot. Oh and I forgot its how big the body is not the horns. From a hunters standpoint I would shoot a bigger rack then a bigger body any day just my opinion.

Thanks for the numbers GOOD LUCK John Stoltzfus

Deerboy

I'm only making the point that you said CWD is the reason. That is the craziest thing that I have ever heard of. We ( in Oklahoma) have to test all deer over 12 months of age that die. I trust the breeders here to be testing what they should. In Texas is it not the rule that you only have to test 20% of your dead deer? Who would I trust, the guys that are testing them all. I really don't care about the borders being open but your statement about the CWD was the reason I even spoke my opinion and it is just that MY OPINION.



J 5

I agree with you about all health issues. EHD is the biggest threat to all of us. NOT CWD... Northern semen and Texas does are the best way NO doubt for Texas. We sell semen to Texas and have bought semen from Texas. For ME, the BS over CWD being the reason for closed borders was wrong. The main(not the only) threat for CWD in our captive herds will be from the wild deer and elk. I would be more concerned with a wild deer or elk from the west of your state than I would be a captive from the North. Once again, this is my opinion only...

TX breeders only test 20% of the dead deer?

Here we test 100% over the age of 12 months whether on a breeding farm or a hunting ranch.

Very interesting.

Arrowhead ,,Cwd IS MY REASON for not wanting boarders to be open.(my opinion!!!)I realize that most northern programs have clean records and would be safe for import but can you guarantee that only they would be allowed to import deer in ?Of course you cant. Its crazy to say that open boarders would not highten chances of cwd in Texas. Open boarders means open to anyone, Im sure some states cwd monitering programs are not as stringent as others thats what scares me .It is no coincidence we have not seen cwd in texas,I would like to keep it that way....PERIOD!!

Deerboy, I understand your concern. With open borders strict guidelines would be a must as it is with my state. Can I guarantee that? Of course not, I DON'T MAKE THE RULES FOR TEXAS... Man, I wish I did though..lol As I said before CWD doesn't scare me as much as EHD. THis is what I love the most about these forums, we can agree to disagree. Thanks for the fun. mp

J5 Ranch and deer boy.....I have asked this question 3 times now with no answer yet......What do you think would happen to the industry if all of the States took the same actions as your state has by closing it's borders? As for who has tougher deer now we are starting to sound like 5 year olds..........yes our northerns have a hard time with EHD only because they have not been exposed to the disease as have the southern deer plain and simple has nothing to do with what deer is tougher..........I will say it again Deer boy.....we have not had CWD in our state of PA and our borders have been open.........it is not a coincidence it is called LUCK!! if your going to get CWD your going to get it and it will come through the WILD.........our deer here in the North are the most thoroughly treated and tested animals being raised.....meaning they are safe!! So yoiu can fight all you want and have all the excuses you want about the borders being closed.........it's not fair and it's not good for the Industry ......if we all worried about our own States and shut our selves down from one another.....we all know what would happen to this Industry!!!

It was never about CWD, I was in on the final discussions. The TAHC who has jurisdiction over all animal health and movement issues in the state of Texas was on board with the national CWD program. It was the Texas Deer Association (TDA) that pressured TPWL to vote to stop movement. I contacted NADFA when it was happening but they got hood winked into believing there was some master plan right up to the end. If CWD was a threat they would have stopped elk but TPWL doesn't have jurisdiction over elk, a non-native species. I'm convinced that's why TDA doesn’t want us out from under TPWL regulations. First thing that would change would be opening the boarder.



Also, EHD is not a north vs south disease, they all get it, some just have better immune systems. I brought 10 doe into TX before the boarder closed we’ve lost 2 to EHD and we get it every year. I’ve had several of them founder due to high fever but survive. Do I think the native deer have an advantage sure they do, but the Northern deer that survive have revolutionized deer breeding in TX.



Here’s my prediction, as EHD becomes more prevalent in the north the breeders will want hardier deer as soon as that happens the boarders will reopen because the export market will become more profitable than the local market.



It was money that closed the boarder in TX and it will be money that reopens the boarder!



“Competition is not only the basis of protection to the consumer, but is the incentive to progress.” - Hoover