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I want to use BAM to sedate

Antlershed

Antlershed

Joined Apr 2009
1,562 Posts | 0+
cental Pennsylvania
Months ago I thought I seen a thread for BAM, searched but couldn't find it.

Anyways, I remember many guys commenting on how well it's worked. I've been wanting to try it once my telezol gets used up, and it pretty much is.

The last few buyers that came for my bucks, both darted them with BAM. amazing results. Amazing how fast they come out of it when reversed.

My question is, where do I get it? Just tell my vet to order it? Or is there a place I can order it, then they call my vet for a prescription? Thanks guys.
 
Zoopharm is the company that makes. You can contact them and then your vet will need to send them a prescription. You can have these filed and filled as you need them instead of having a batch that doesn't get used and goes bad. It was running around 250-300 per kit which contains 11ml and reversals. If you have any questions about using BAM feel free to give me a call. I have probably done a few hundred sedations at this point and have a good understanding of it. Good luck, Ryan
 
Thanks Ryan, I'll give you a call this week sometime. I would like to hear some of your expirences.
 
I just used it Sunday morning on a 2 year old buck to treaT for lumpy jaw I used the fawn dosage which is .5 ccs of bam. Out like a light within 5 mins of darting!!! The recommended dosage for mature bucks is 1.5ccs I think. I don't have the paper that comes with the kit in front of me at the moment.
 
Stuff is unreal....I would never use anything else again!! Josh Newton first got me into it and I will never go back. I have literally had deer on their feet and gone once reversed  before I could walk the 100yds out of the gate. Nothing but positive experiences. And like was mentioned before you get it from the vet and its called a BAM kit since there are actually 3 seperate parts to it...BAM itself and the 2 seperate reveversal drugs.


 


jason
 
I put deer down for the first time ever this year for testing.


All went really good for me. I had never even put a deer down before.


It was easy and worked great. I had to go thru my vet to get it.


I can say it worked a lot faster both ways than I did. 


Bam is good stuff.


 


Brent Thomure
 
I have used a fair amount of BAM and really like it.  Deer seem to go down quicker and reverse much faster that those sedated with Telazol mix.  I did have  a stressful experience moving a breeder buck last fall.  I darted a 2 yr. old that I wanted to live breed some does to with 1.5CC BAM and a 3/4 inch needle on the dart.  He went down perfect.  We moved him into the new pen and reversed him.  All went well and he was up in a very few minutes.  Seemed great.  I went back out to check him about an hour later and he was completely down and unconscious again.  I finally got him up but he would not stay on his feet.  Every time he would lay down he stretched out with his head on the ground and he looked like he trying to die.  I called a couple of my "deer guru" friends and they recommended more reversal and trying to keep him on his feet.


Their opinion was the 3/4 inch needle did not get past the fat on the buck and a bunch of the BAM was left in the fat.  Blood flow is considerably less there which allowed the BAM to continue to be released for several hours after given. 


The next 8 hours or so was pretty stressful for me but he finally walked it off and recovered completely. 


I now shoot 1" needles on my darts especially on larger deer with winter hair.
 
We started using BAM this year and love it. Our only complaint is with the kits. Seems we always have a lot of the reversal drug leftover. Inquired about just buying the individual knockdown drug but they said it would be too expensive to sell that way???
 
Is anybody out there using a product called MK2?  ( I think that is the right name)  It may just be MK.


I talked to a representative from that company at the P.A. Sale last fall.


Sounded a lot like BAM except there is just one reversal drug and the dose matched the amount of sedative given.
 
We've been using BAM for a couple years now.  Great stuff!!  We've also used MK this past year, for AI, and while they don't come out of it quite as well as the BAM, we would try it again.  They seemed to be in a deeper state of sedation than the BAM.  Both seem good but maybe slightly different usage for each.  Just my opinion and observation.
 
From what I heard, Mk is still in a trial and error period. I moved 2, 3 year old bucks with a fellow this past fall. He used Mk. Just from my experience at his farm, I will have to see better results before I even think about using it..


Both of the bucks where very flinchy, for lack of a better term. One buck actually jumped up with a face mask on and me hanging on to an antler, after being topped off with .5 cc more than required of mk. Did they go down, yes. Did they want to, no!!


For the price and ease of use, bam is really the way to go.
 
I talked with the represenative from Precision Pharmacy at the Top 30, who is the maker of the "MK" drug. Medetomidine/Ketamine Mix and the reversal drug is Atipamezole, which is the same as the reversal that is used in BAM. It comes as 2 bottles, the knock down drug and the reversal. No mixing necessary. The thing I like about it is that the deers body is numb when using MK, so when you are AI'ing your does they dont feel a thing. The conception rates in theory should be higher when using MK. I help a deer farmer out this fall and he used MK when he AI'd. We will find out if his conception rates are higher this spring than they have been in the past. I also know MK is cheaper than BAM.
 
Magnum Valley Whitetails1005871421113899



I talked with the represenative from Precision Pharmacy at the Top 30, who is the maker of the "MK" drug. Medetomidine/Ketamine Mix and the reversal drug is Atipamezole, which is the same as the reversal that is used in BAM. It comes as 2 bottles, the knock down drug and the reversal. No mixing necessary. The thing I like about it is that the deers body is numb when using MK, so when you are AI'ing your does they dont feel a thing. The conception rates in theory should be higher when using MK. I help a deer farmer out this fall and he used MK when he AI'd. We will find out if his conception rates are higher this spring than they have been in the past. I also know MK is cheaper than BAM.




Why would them feeling no pain or  being numb have anything to do with sperm reaching an egg for conception?
 
the K in MK is Ketamine and there is no reversal for it. If the deer is out for ten minutes and you reverse the deer will have a hard recovery because the Ketamine is still acting.


 


If the deer is going to be out for an hour no prob as the Ketamine has been absorbed and is no longer a factor in recovery. I never use anything I cannot 100% reverse.


 


BAM is a much better alround sedation drug.
 
Four Seasons Whitetails1005901421115650



Why would them feeling no pain or  being numb have anything to do with sperm reaching an egg for conception?




Ketamine keeps the muscles in a more relaxed state which is better for AI.


 


IMO this MK shouldn't be too much different to the Zoletil (telazol) /xylazine mix.


 


Just for discussion.the A in BAM is IMO what makes it a better brew for straight capture, azaperone is an excellent tranquilliser for deer. Azaperone alone is also great for transport, or if a deer has been netted or bulldogged. It helps prevent capture myopathy & is faster acting than other LAN's.


 


Sharkey


 


Edit


Azaperone (the A in BAM) can not be reversed either.
 
Four Seasons Whitetails1005901421115650



Why would them feeling no pain or  being numb have anything to do with sperm reaching an egg for conception?




It would be less stress on the deer. I believe any stress that can be taken away would result in better conception rates. I originally posted it just to get more into out about it and just relaying what the rep told me about MK.
 
Magnum Valley Whitetails1006221421208508



It would be less stress on the deer. I believe any stress that can be taken away would result in better conception rates. I originally posted it just to get more into out about it and just relaying what the rep told me about MK.




Mate. I think you would do just as well with the Zoetil (Telazol) / xylazine brew as with this "MK". The Zoletil (Telazol) has diazepam in equal ratios to the cyclohexane, to prevents the "ketamine effect", which can be rather nasty in deer.


 


Sharkey
 
Hands down, BAM is the only way to go. I've darted a hundred or so deer with Telazol/Xylazine mix (which something always goes not right) But with BAM, I still just giggle like a girl, when I watch it work!
 
Magnum Valley Whitetails1006221421208508



It would be less stress on the deer. I believe any stress that can be taken away would result in better conception rates. I originally posted it just to get more into out about it and just relaying what the rep told me about MK.




Well i could see where it may help Ai if you had to chase and dart numerous times. I do not believe people change to BAM because they have problems putting deer down but rather the wake up part of it. Then if a person using a chute to syringe the doe in the chute would not be adding any more stress by using a different medication. A sleeping doe is a sleeping doe really, I just cant see how it would help ai the old fashion way, and lap Ai where he semen gets dropped right on the egg?      Will be an interesting read for sure if some research gets done.
 
I saw a fawn this year that had been sedated with straight Telezol. It took two days for the fawn to die and it was not pretty. 


 


anyone that thinks Rompum/Telezol is as good as BAM, simply put, does not have a clue what they are talking about.


 


Todd has it spot on....
 

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