Your help Is Needed

Virgil i was thinking the same thing as it is the deer farmers that pay the due's and make the donations every year to keep them up and going..Mabey thats why its penn deer FARMER asst and not penn deer RANCH asst.I think if it is us giving the time,money,hunts ect.ect.They could at least put the name and blessings of some kind from the pdfa.This might backfire on the asst if they dont help in some kind of way because you know how they need our help to keep them going and only a few lost memberships might hurt!!!!

Matt, we appreciate all you have done on this project and the time you have commited to it. We also appreciate the positive comments toward the PDFA board members. We look forward to working with you in the future and hearing any comments or suggestions you may have.



Larry & Kelly Pittenger

Sorry guys I've been distracted on other personal issues but when this idea came about it was to benefit the whole industry. I guess I'm confused but as a Missouri board member I would be overwhelmed with joy to see the efforts brought forth from these fellow deer farmers and ranchers. United we stand divided we fall! I think I would slow down and take a good look at the purpose for all of this. It will benefit everybody. There are no negatives in my eyes. If your state Board has there hands full with other issues, that doesn't mean you can't carry on. Matt, once again I personally want to thank you for everything you've done. Keep in mind there is always obstacles with everything we do and you cannot please everyone. I still plan on getting with a few preserves in Missouri and putting on a free hunt for a doe give away at our booth.

As a group we shouldn’t get discouraged!



Hunts are REALLY REALLY REALLY easy to give away. I suggest for now that if you are a breeder wanting to help, get with a preserve owner and if you are a preserve owner, get with some breeders. This can easily be done in small groups until a bigger organization wants to take it on. Another group that can really help is the local SCI chapter. They usually will jump right in to line up kids, veterans, or anybody that may not normally have the opportunity to hunt a preserve.



Our mission can easily be promoted through shows by piggybacking on preserves that are attending shows to promote hunts. Set up some information at their booth. They should be glad to help, I know I do and will continue to do so.



A lot can be done with very little organization or money!



Remember the most important thing we can do as breeders is to promote and speak about preserves in a POSITIVE way. It is extremely disappointing when I hear a group of breeders talking about preserves in a crowd and saying things like "I would never hunt behind fence but to each his own" or something like that. There are many breeders out there who will talk down about preserves and then turn right around and try to sell them their stockers. As you well know I could go on forever on this topic but I wont. At least not now.



I just want to say keep up the effort! We can all make a small effort and if each one of us can convince one or two people to try a preserve hunt, it wont take long to grow the numbers. This year was our best ever for first time hunters. As the wild deer herd gets worse, the preserves get better. And as the hunts get cheaper the comparison to low fence deer gets better. Our falling prices represent a great opportunity to really make a push for new hunters. Lets take advantage of it!

I believe like most have stated here and that is a hunt can always be given away. Like Sam said SCI would jump on this program with support. I would encourage all too work together for the goal of the industry on these good ideas and not quite. Your other choice is quite and you also can be the only deer farmer in your State.

Paul, count me in!

I dont think it is a matter of taking sides.We all are here for one main goal and we know what that is.We are mostly all members of pdfa and we know what they have done in the past and what they are working on now.Most of the board members are in the same boat as we are so they know what we are trying to do is a positive thing for farms and ranches.There must be a good reason that all of us do not know as to why they did not jump on board at this time!!!Matt you and henry got the ball rolling and also have alot of us backing you guys up!!Keep up the battle and who knows where we could go!!!

Respectfully this will be my final post on Deer Farmer.

Since I have been a member of Deer Farmer my goal was to educate, identify problems in our industry and discuss solutions. Threw my desire and passion to help other deer farmers I have put my foot in my mouth, made many friends and perhaps made some enemies. But my hearts goal is to be at peace with everyone. No deer, no plan is worth loosing a friend.

I consider you all friends

God bless you all and I have tears in my eyes as I hit the Post Quick Reply button for the last time.

Andy Foor

Wisdom didnt you just say leaders dont quit.Well then you dont need to be quiting the lead that you have started.You move many of our animals through your ranch and we can't afford to lose that...Keep up your good words and work!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nobody has to choose sides if the plan is already in motion why not go threw with it. I don't understand, is it cause PDFA does not want us to or what. The comment I made earlier is I just thought it would be a waste for PDFA not to take advantage of the extra money this could make for us. I fully support our org no matter what but that does not have to stop us from doing what we were doing.

I must chime in here as well since I am a part of this as much as Matthew. When we first discussed this and started it all seemed to be going well and we never imaging the PDFA not backing it but that is what happened. Now since we did not have the support of our state organization, it makes it very difficult to continue in a united envioroment which we muct be in order for this to be a success.

We could continue as is but what do we gain and what do we loose. We need to fill in the blanks, fill the voids, answer all questions and be completly one side, one unit, one body, not seperate factions. I too was and still am disappointed but as a business man I must also look at the larger picture and what is best for the deer farmers not only in the state but others.

When I put out material or a special project I do so with pride and I know it is good products or a good idea. While I still think this was a good idea, the PDFA has been doing this a lot longer and I believe they have some comcerns that must be addressed first before we continue, there are other variables to consider. Trust me, no one is more disappointed then I am, a lot of hard work and many hours were put into this in a short time and I believe we came up with a workable idea but it was rushed and we may have left holes.

Let us plan this for next year on a larger scale with more ranches involved, more deer and maybe the PDFA support if we can work out their issues which must be heard since they are our state organization. You know the old saying is, "you cannot please all the people all the time" and even with the PDFA I am certain someone will have an issue otr a concern, that is just the way it is. Matthew has been a good spokesman for our group and I have for the most part kept quiet since he is the spokesman and I know how he is feeling because I am feeling the same way.

I believe this can be even larger next year but please allow us to work out the issues so we all can be united or we will follow suit with what is happening in other states, we must present an idea that most can say is good. I pray this makes sense to everyone and I am sorry if some are upset but it is not our intention to do so but what we do want to do is grow hunting at ranches, educate the general public so when the anti's do get here, and they will, we stand together.

I have enjoyed reading your posts Wisdom ,I will miss them.By the way I agree showing,bottle fed fawns in 1/2 hectare enclosures doesn't brand game reserves well.Look at the dozens off overseas countries & share some stratigies.In most countries game farmers are associate members of professional hunting associations,not full members.Its like a plumber who does some work for a hotel & then tries to tell the proprieter what brand of cola to serve.Game farmers are obviously an important player in the industry,so are game managers & the hunting guides,however it is the reserve owner whose interests are highest on the hierarchy.The best value for the marketing dollar will be from promoting the conservation value of game reserves.Promote the conservation through sustainable use concept & the collateral benefits to bio diversity from game reserves.Sorry to ask a dumb question.What is the Nth American definition of "fair chase'.

I was looking for the booth at the PA Sportsmans show, and I missed it. I hope to talk with you all soon to learn how I can begin a small farm and help with promotions of the PA Deer Farms and hunts.

There was no booth. The plug got pulled on the whole thing cause PDFA was not going to back it up with their support.

Matthew and I will be attending the Feb. meeting and working on ironing out all issues so this will benifit everyone of the PA Deer farmers. As Matthew stated we are looking to the future. I do have a booth in the main hall down isle 8100 at the end and would be more then happy to discuss this with you if you drop by.

Henry--



I will not be back to the show, but maybe I can visit you sometime in the near future.



Thank you--



Dan