Best producing daughters

I would very much enjoy it if Fred Huebner got on here and told about his "Angela" & "Tina" doe. They are awesome doe. Fred's proclivity to be garrulous, gregarious, and loquacious when discussing their production was the inspiration for me naming one of my "Arty" sons "Toot My Horn". He is on this years antler page8.

Thanks for all the replies so far. very informative.


I agree Bell, Hopefully we'll get some more replies from others, and keep this moving along.

On a lighter note, the term "superdoe" and " powerdoe" are thrown around often. We at Deer Ridge farm have what we think of is a special doe ( some may even say she is "super" or "Powerful"). The does name is April, she is the daughter of Jerome patrick / Dr J's full sister.  We refer to her as a multi-tasker, since prior to breeding season she is one of our "Pee does" ( we collect and sell doe urine). April does a very good job of coming up to the collection unit every afternoon to spend the night and give us her best ( urine) for sale to hunters. Once urine collection is completed then April is Ai'd to Maxbo Solidcore and this May gave us quintuplets. Yes, she gave us 5 fawns and they are all still living So, when looking and evaluating the ability of a doe to add value to a farm I think April more than does her share for Deer Ridge farm.

Hey guys, good conversation... I love it !!! Bell I think Blazer did breed at Joni's because when we were there in 2005 it seemed every nice buck he had was a Blazer son if I'm not mistaken... That year we ended up buying Y27 who is Hurricane's sister.. ( Thunder daughter out of Blazers mom ).. We weren't gonna buy her as the guy had a few deer I liked the pedigree better at that time but the guy looked me in the eye and said that's the best doe..we ended up getting all three and a few years later a seen he knew what he was talking about... Her two Soaring Eagle daughters ended up being Sophie and Sonia... I am now breeding sons of those does to daughters of those does and I am very pleased with those two yr old sons.. Keep up the great discussion !!!

Pdaddy, for those who don't know who Dr. J is, he is the son of Dandy, who is the full brother of Avalanche. Their mother is Suzy, a Blazer doe, their father was Thunder. Had to mention that after I read the comments from Amos. All Dandy did was sire Dingus who topped out here at 480", and went on to grow even bigger in LA last year.

Stevel, I am glad you brought that to light, I am enclosing a picture of Dr. J ( Blazer grandson) and Blazer, notice any similiarities, ( I do). As you pointed out Dr. J's sire is Dandy ( Avalanches full brother( Thunder / Susy ( Blazer doe). Let's look also at Avalanche in relation to Dr J and Blazer. Even I can see the strong , powerful influence of Blazer with frame and balanced drops.

Great Post !  Amos, we have a direct Blazer daughter and the DNA paperwork that came with our doe was sent in by Joni Beechy. Our Blazer doe has only had one son for us and last year he was a 196"  2 year old.  We have a yearling doe fawn from our Blazer doe and our Hardcore/Reno buck Vinny. Bred her again to Vinny and this year we got a single doe fawn too. Don't know but maybe she is about done throwing eggs @ 11 years old.   

Forgot to mention, our Blazer doe was out of a Northern Gold doe. We don't know anything about Northern Gold, anybody have pics or info?

Mike, The buck in my avatar is out of a Tonto son that goes back to Avalanche on a Northern Gold doe. He was just over 200 as a yearling and was 30 inches outside. He was over 300 at 2 and over 30 wide outside. Here is him as a yearling. I have about 70 good young does that all go back to the Patrick and avalanche line. The Patrick and Avalanche line consistently produces great frames and inches. 

Mike

Northern Gold was a half bro to Rage the sire of Eclipse. He was also a son of Lester. There were two Buckwheat sons at Dennis' place purchased from Todd Carrol. I think Chester the sire of Lester was a son of the heavier mass non typical one. I have semen in the tank from Northern Gold. I believe his largest score was around 242". Dennis Salsgiver in Michigan has this set of his horns. A Northern Gold daughter purchased at the first Top 30 sale was the mother of my wide GT buck.

Hope this is helpful.

I had to edit my info at the beginning of this post. I was hurriedly posting between stops in my UPS truck. Rage and Northern Gold were half brothers. Buckwheat was found in a cornfield in northern Indiana and was raised by Todd Carrol.

I love reading this thread. Sounds like I need some patrick does! They seem to do well for most. Padaddy, I really like your post.. I like how you looked at it in another light. Sure we all have good producers, or know of good ones that others have. I like how you said how valuable your doe as far as a day to day basis. We can have a doe that produces a 250" two year old every year, but yet she is a bad mother, or she pulls hair and fights with her pen mates. Then we can have our "special" deer. The ones that are tame as puppies and love visitors. I have a doe named nevaeh, she is a blessing to my farm. She produces two nice fawns, mothers them well, as well as mothering other fawns, and she is the star of my farm. I call her my little Nelson whitetails mascot. She steals attention from the herd when visitors come, most non deer farming visitors that come are more excited about feeding nev her nilla wafers than looking at a 200" buck. Time will tell how nevaeh's bucks look. She is "supposed" to produce well for me, she comes from some great stock. But even if her sons dissapoint me, she will stay here, although I must say her first twin yearling bucks are looking good so far. She may not breed anymore if she is not producing what I want, but she'll always be spoiled and have a good home. The funny thing is, she is a doe that wouldn't bring 100$ in the breeder market, but I don't think I could sell her for less than a million, she's to special, lol. My doe blue 4 is my best inches producer, but nevaeh is my favorite, lol.

Thanks for the info sdbigbucks and Bell.


  It was very helpful.

After some more thinking today TNT the sire of Laurie's RPM, Rage, and Northern Gold were all brothers and not half brothers. They were all sons of Lester, out of Chester, out of the Buckwheat son mentioned.

Bell, Thanks for the info on Northern Gold, I couldn't find any info on him and was always wondering about his pedigree.


Antlershed, I also have one doe that I will ever get rid of, she is the calmest sweetest doe I have. She's a Tonto daughter and has given me all doe fawns so far and this spring she gave me a set of triplets, 2 does and a buck. I can't wait to see what he turns into. Her name is Old Red.

Glad I could be helpful. Love the deer!

In my post #30 I originally said Northern Gold and Lester were brothers but I edited it. I read an updated article in the new issue of Deer Tracking magazine that says he does in fact DNA as Lester's bro. I looked on the NDR registry and they both DNA to Chester with no DNA # for their dams. I assume the markers on both their dams are a match? Chester was out of the heavy massed Buckwheat son per a credible source. If you want to see Northern Gold's horns go to Dennis Salsgiver's. He was his breeder buck and was where our Northern Gold doe came from including GT's mom#33. There is a fellow to talk with about this line whose has the memory of an elephant. He moved all these deer to about every new home they found. If the genuine history of this line is what I were after, I think I would start with this guy who by the way is also the person who submitted Indiana Prides horns. I would be careful believing anyone who says that Lester son in the photo has 16" tines. Ask these people who it was that brought the deer to them and you will find each of their origins.

I've had a straw of Blazer in storage for many years.  From the looks of these posts I should use it this year.  Thanks for the information great read.

Hands down my favorite doe lines are out of Wilmer's Red 16 and Thiex's 33.  I'd love to have Jewell too.  Next would be 2 Flees does out of Buster I believe were sisters R32 and R33 - Mojo, Premier, Updraft, Sudden Explosion grand and great grand dam's.  Not all these girls are even still alive but if we are imagining and I could have 4 does proven to produce amazing daughters this is it.  I don't know about their daughter's offspring but Orange 2 Complex's dam or Omega's dam wow. 


 


1- CHW Red 16


2- Thiex 33


3- BR Jewell


4- Flees R33 - R32

TRUTH989401413898494



Hands down my favorite doe lines are out of Wilmer's Red 16 and Thiex's 33.  I'd love to have Jewell too.  Next would be 2 Flees does out of Buster I believe were sisters R32 and R33 - Mojo, Premier, Updraft, Sudden Explosion grand and great grand dam's.  Not all these girls are even still alive but if we are imagining and I could have 4 does proven to produce amazing daughters this is it.  I don't know about their daughter's offspring but Orange 2 Complex's dam or Omega's dam wow. 


 


1- CHW Red 16


2- Thiex 33


3- BR Jewell


4- Flees R33 - R32




Those are 4 super choices and a pretty good assessment of production.

I had a long post explaining many of my ideas on breeding and decided to delete it. Instead I will just say that on my farm the best production has come over the years from the following.


 


* A doe known to me as yellow #21. She came from the Guyland VanAsten farm. She was a double bred Mr Awesome doe. My first 200" buck came out of her back in the mid 1990's. Few of you will even know who the buck Mr Awesome even was, but he was a big part of the foundation for Cougar Ridge and I suspect Sam James had a few girls from him as well years back.


 


* A doe known to me as Spice. This girl came from my cousin Dale Kremsreiter when I first started. Dale back in the day might well have had the best line of the deer in the entire country. Fred Huebner can attest to the production quality of that line as he purchased a little girl from Dale back when the Top 30 was made up of the true top 30 breeders in the country, before it became a popularity contest.


 


* I purchased a straw of Avalanche and crossed him into the two lines mentioned above. The girls out of that were powerhouse producers for me. 200" two year olds were the norm and this is way back when most farms were still trying to get 200" four year olds. I always said that Avalanche was a powerhouse producer that never got the respect he deserved. That can be said about many in the Patrick line.


 


* I also purchased two does from the Flees family. Both of which produced very well for me.


**One doe we called "F1" crossed with Bucky Jr gave me one of the best looking 6x6 typical frames I have ever seen. I don't think his net score was off his gross score by more than maybe an inch and his gross was over 200". That same doe bred to Maxbo gave me a buck called Max Thrust as well. Max Thrust totally out produced himself with EVERY son he sired.


**The other doe we called "F2" (also known as Y-0289) and she gave me IR Dolly who is the mother to Updraft and Downdraft. Few know that I actually made that same cross a second time and had a full sister and brother to Updraft and Downdraft. I have no idea what ever happened to the sister, but the brother died of pneumonia in July of the year he was a yearling. His rack was absolutely crushing the yearling rack of Updraft and when he died it was a bitter pill to swallow. Downdraft has a couple of yearling sons this fall but nothing else to see his production. Updraft's production has been incredible.


Buying those two does and the way I bred them gave me great success and I would have to say it was the key to how well I did in the breeder market.


 


As to coming powerhouse does that I suspect will show their worth to me goes...


* I until recently had a Hardcore doe from Cougar Ridge. Her oldest sons are yearlings this fall but showing some great potential and I suspect this girl will show her value to me.


 


* This year I added a doe to my program that goes back to Little Patches. The same Little Patches that is the mother to Lakota. I of course have nothing to prove my point about her, but I suspect she will be a great production doe for me as well.


 


There are many lines and specific does across the country that have done amazing things. If I had to narrow down the key elements of where my herd success came from I would say, Yellow #21, Spice, F1, F2, the purchase of Avalanche semen, Maxbo semen, Bucky Jr semen and Big Guy semen. I made money on various other purchases and crosses as well, but these key moves gave me serious production. I also have to give MUCH credit to my cousin for helping me get started. He was my best friend and is missed very much. I also met a lot of great people over the years that made the deer business a lot of fun for me. Some of them will be my friends long after the industry is shutdown for good.