Our Industry, 8000 Deer Farmers, Only 300 Attend Auctions

Eric

You said that I said: You state that some of the auctioneers are paid off or slipped enough money!

This may be the case, how ever I did not say that or even intend to imply any thing negative concerning the auctioneers. I also did not use the word cheated nor did I intend to imply it. I did mention favoritism. But don’t we all have that problem.

I was not attacking you or any one so please reread that post with a different focus or attitude and you will find I did answer your question.

Midwest Deer Sales said:

Andy

Very good points made as to why "YOU" do not sale at auctions but that still does not answer the question as to why there are not more attending the auctions if just for the friends and partnerships that can be formed there.

You state that some of the auctioneers are paid off or slipped enough money! I wish you could tell me of one instance that has happened. I would like to know because as an auction owner I can assure you that has never happened to me, and I dang sure bet Christ Miller or Steve Chupp has never be paid off. Everyone needs to get off why they have been cheated in one way or another and are not going to auctions and quite making excuses. Fact is auctions are the best way to get to know the folks in the industry and if many of you can not see my point then fine. I am just trying to give all the guys that can't sell their deer an avenue to make more acquaintances and if you want to tell them otherwise, then you go ahead and keep pushing them down the ladder, but don't blame the people that are trying to help them and find new ways to them involved.

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You ask a question Eric. I was wondering why our industry has some 8,000 deer farmers and on any given year why only 300 or so attend or opt to put something in an auction.

You ask, I answered. Sorry it was not acceptable.

Know that I am not bitching or wining because my animals are not marketed. We have sold every thing we wanted to sell up to this point with out auctions. I am glad there are auctions out there. Some breeders with out the auctions advertising there deer would be between a rock and a hard place.

I feel your heart is right to encourage breeders to attend auctions as I was when I encouraged breeders to join there state ***.

I no longer wish to consign at auctions or do I wish to purchase deer at said auctions for the reasons posted earlier. How ever I attended the Pa. Fall sale, the summer Pa. Picnic, the spring Pa benefit auction and am going to the Ohio NEDIFA conference.

How can I get in the Big Bad Breeders club.

By the way that 300 inch producing doe is for sale. She is bred to a 300 buck this year.

If you are in the market to buy I am in the market to sell.

Arrowhead Whitetails said:

Eric, we too are new to the deer business. However, we have made it a point to get involved and not sit on the sidelines and ***** because noone is marketing our animals. Do the big boys make good money? YES Have we made good money in the sales so far? YES. It is a matter of how you plan to market your animals. Our plan is the breeding stock side of it. Will we have shooters? Hell yes... Not ALL breeding stock will make a breeder therefore, they are a shooter. As for the auctions, what a great place to meet people and form friendships, partnerships and sell your animals. I too have had animals turned down by the auctions. Some that were bought from that very auction a year or two before. Was I mad? NO They are doing their job of creating a solid group of animals for ALL the buyers and sellers. Hey Roger, Wayne and a few of you other new guys to the auctions have you made any money? I Know you have... Just from us...lol You guys are these "BIG BAD BREEDERS"

Wisdom, if you have a doe that produces a 300 inch son, let me know when she is for sale. I'm always in the market for a proven producer.

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Arrowhead Whitetails said:

Hey Roger, Wayne and a few of you other new guys to the auctions have you made any money? I Know you have... Just from us...lol You guys are these "BIG BAD BREEDERS"

Wisdom, if you have a doe that produces a 300 inch son, let me know when she is for sale. I'm always in the market for a proven producer.

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Michael, I haven't made any money in this business



I know what you are getting at though. A simple average joe like me is some big bad breeder

All I have done is research what I felt were the strongest lines in the country, picked out a couple of them, and then stuck to them. I used carefully planned line breeding keeping in mind some of the things I learned from others in the industry, and outside the industry. ( Yes John, you were one of them ) I surely have never claimed to have invented line breeding.

Jeeze, I'm not Al **** and the whole internet thing all over again.

NOW THAT WAS FUNNY GUYS!

I also always kept my personal breeding desires in mind while still watching carefully the strength inside the industry. Meaning what has consistently held its value.



I think many are totally missing the fact a shift took place recently. Look at both the Top 30 sale and the Midwest Select sale. In both sales there were names that in previous years weren't a part of the top sales in the country. Congrats to all of those "new people"! Really though none of them are "new" at all. They worked hard building a program and then made some returns.

Guys like Rick Browning, Henry Woodard, Shannon Thiex, Rich Huff, Troy Gann, Wayne Scott, Jere Hissong, James Hail, Rusty Carroll, Wilmer Martin, Mark Pierce, Jarrod Washburn, and several others.

This industry like any other industry evolves. Watch as even more "new" names emerge in the next couple of years.

Wisdom said:

How can I get in the Big Bad Breeders club.

By the way that 300 inch producing doe is for sale. She is bred to a 300 buck this year.

If you are in the market to buy I am in the market to sell.

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Ahhh, but is she bottle fed?

Again people THAT was FUNNY! Oh come on, even if your not on the same side of the fence with some of these issues you have to admit it is funny how we can all play on each other like that

Top 30 Breeders

Roger Petroski, Levi Weaver, Levi Mast, Eddie Ray Burkholder, O Lamar Burkholder, Rusty Carroll, Greg Flees, Wilmer Martin, Edwin Ropp, Phil Schreyer, Mark Sipes, Joh Ervin Stolfus, Jarrod Washburn, Josh and Wes Wenrich, Henry Woodard, Dave McQuaig, Billy Sage, Harry Strawser, Russ Walk, Mark Pierce, Amos Kaufmann, Dave Griffith, David Esh, Brad Sullivan, Nathan Blosser.



These are the BIg Bad Breeders that are trying to steal from the Industry? Give me a break, Most of these guys are great guys that have awesome deer. Anyone would love to have deer from them.

They are selling a superior product and it has a premium price.

We need a "like button" like on face book cause that was some funny uh...crap right there!

Rog, you took one of my next questions. And is your status good? Also, what's the price for said doe?

Will, you left off a few: Dream Ranch, Xtreme Boys, Curt Waldvogel to add a few more



p.s. Will can we have some of our money back? You can call it the Ainsworth stimulus package. I promise to reinvest it...lol

Arrowhead Whitetails said:

Rog, you took one of my next questions. And is your status good? Also, what's the price for said doe?

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Michael you might want to watch those off the farm sales. Sounds like he charges a lot.

I will give my two cents on this subject... The auctions are a good way for people to sell their deer, however they are made up of the same deer. Everyone is chasing the same three or four deer. Everything you see is bred the same way one way or the other. I have thrown every auction book down in discust about half way through it. Its kinda like if you seen one you have seen them all kinda thing. I personally think the industry needs some new blood in the market. We have bred so deep into a handfull of bucks that we are making a bunch of similar deer. I kinda wish that we never started AIing deer. There are a few farmers that have picked a line like roger and stuck with it.. Look at updrafts pedigree...And for all of you that havn't seen the rachett line in PA you are missing out.. That is how animals are supposed to be bred. Thats how the flees, borntrager,borkholder,griffins,waldvogel lines became so solid. sorry if i left anyone out on that. They bred within the line for characteristics they liked... I am ready for some change in the blood... tired of the same deer selling over and over ... everyone wants to follow and nobody wants to lead ...

If you ask me i think Andy sells his deer at a very reasonable price.My buddy bought some great deer off of him and they were bigger boddied then most i have seen plus Andy was able to tell him or show him what every deer in his pedigrees were and what they produced. His deer in my opinion are far greater than most in the industry.They may not be big names but they produce if you do your home work you would know this.So many of these so called top deer look like crap but people buy just because of all the hype behind the names. There are many big beutiful bucks out there that don't get into auctions for one reason or a nother that are producing just as well or better than these big dogs.Auctions are great to meet people and see there deer but to much stuff being bid up buy owners. Example i saw a straw go for 11,000 that sells off the farm for 10,000 something fishy there if you ask me.

Andy if you are trying to make a sell you need to go to proper forum.

Midwest Deer Sales said:

John

Short and to the point. Sounds to me like you are selling the new guys your deer that you can not get rid of. Huh.

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Boy, you really got me on that one. Did you think of that all by yourself?



I will let that *** slide but just so you know, though, I am more than willing to take it to that level, if you insist on taking it there.















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kurthumphrey said:

I will give my two cents on this subject... The auctions are a good way for people to sell their deer, however they are made up of the same deer. Everyone is chasing the same three or four deer. Everything you see is bred the same way one way or the other. I have thrown every auction book down in discust about half way through it. Its kinda like if you seen one you have seen them all kinda thing. I personally think the industry needs some new blood in the market. We have bred so deep into a handfull of bucks that we are making a bunch of similar deer. I kinda wish that we never started AIing deer. There are a few farmers that have picked a line like roger and stuck with it.. Look at updrafts pedigree...And for all of you that havn't seen the rachett line in PA you are missing out.. That is how animals are supposed to be bred. Thats how the flees, borntrager,borkholder,griffins,waldvogel lines became so solid. sorry if i left anyone out on that. They bred within the line for characteristics they liked... I am ready for some change in the blood... tired of the same deer selling over and over ... everyone wants to follow and nobody wants to lead ...

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Very well stated Kurt. That's my point exactly. Everyone in the auctions are basically just trading the same deer around.





WE NEED NEW BLOOD.









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IndependenceRanch said:

Yes John, you were one of them I surely have never claimed to have invented line breeding.

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Nor have I. It is nice to be thanked for the time and effort I put into it as well. I take a lot of pride in the people which I helped better understand linebreeding in order to produce great animals, folks just like yourself, Roger.





I wish you all the best and best of luck to you. Remain humble in your breeding journeys.

If you know how to handle deer, they do not have to be tame

IndependenceRanch said:

Ahhh, but is she bottle fed?

Again people THAT was FUNNY! Oh come on, even if your not on the same side of the fence with some of these issues you have to admit it is funny how we can all play on each other like that

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Thank you Kurt

Well said with out stepping on toes. Perhaps I should let you pre read my post and make corrections

kurthumphrey said:

I will give my two cents on this subject... The auctions are a good way for people to sell their deer, however they are made up of the same deer. Everyone is chasing the same three or four deer. Everything you see is bred the same way one way or the other. I have thrown every auction book down in discust about half way through it. Its kinda like if you seen one you have seen them all kinda thing. I personally think the industry needs some new blood in the market. We have bred so deep into a handfull of bucks that we are making a bunch of similar deer. I kinda wish that we never started AIing deer. There are a few farmers that have picked a line like roger and stuck with it.. Look at updrafts pedigree...And for all of you that havn't seen the rachett line in PA you are missing out.. That is how animals are supposed to be bred. Thats how the flees, borntrager,borkholder,griffins,waldvogel lines became so solid. sorry if i left anyone out on that. They bred within the line for characteristics they liked... I am ready for some change in the blood... tired of the same deer selling over and over ... everyone wants to follow and nobody wants to lead ...

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Eric, i have to say that there is another thing that upsets me when i go to auctions. There is alot of bidding each others deer up to make them look good. I have seen it with my own eyes. It don't take a rocket scientist to figure out what is going on, however the problem is never addressed and it just keeps getting worse. It happened in your midwest select auction... it really puts a bad taste in my mouth about the whole auction. If you caught it going on and banned the buyer and seller from the auctions it would probally slow things down a little. That would cut into your commission so your not going to do that.. I personally think it very disrespectful to other buyers watching your auctions.

Midwest Deer Sales said:

Don't try and parlay this into what ever you want it to sound like. It doesn't work that way on these forums.

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Ok, I will let you answer the questions and you, and only you, can parlay it however you like. These are the top three concerns that I hear the most about.



Eric, can you please explain to me, and the readers, why at some of the auctions the auction promoters are sometimes the 6th highest buyer?



Can you also explain, why the auction promoters are even participating in the purchase of these auction animals? Is it to run up the bids or are they genuinely interested in buying the animal? I recall one deer that was bought by the auction promoter one year and then sometime later was once again on the auction block, where they spent way to long begging for bids. Which this leads me to the next question.



Can you explain why auction promoters will spend 15-20 minutes chanting for bids on their own items, then in turn rush through every other lot only allowing three minutes of floor time - tops?





If you want to get people involved in the auctions, and rebuild bidder confidence, please start by addressing these issues from a auction owner/promoter's standpoint.



A lot of inquiring minds want to know... The floor is all yours.









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